Anything in the F&G code about suppressors?

[TrailerparkTrash]

...Part of my duties is to test out the product and demonstrate it to LEO agencies and the military. How I choose to do that is up to me. And that is the beauty of owning a business. Everything I do is business related.

Equipped with the penal code, the NFA, and my ATF SOT paperwork, I am confident in explaining my situation.

And why do it? Because I can. That is the basis of this country.

Seems to me that you already "knew" the answer to your question in the first place. So why on earth did you ask it to begin with???

You asked a question and you got several opinions. If you don't want to hear the opinions, then do what you wanna do with your silencer.

I disagree (but who the heck am I?) with the fact that you can "demonstrate to LEO" but how is taking it on a HUNTING TRIPdemonstrating it for a law enforcement official??? Why not "demonstrate" it at a range with paper or steel targets?? Do you really think that in the event a Game Warden decides to hook you up while on your "HUNTING TRIP" , you'll have a jury on your side for that argument?

You on the stand: "...Oh, counselor I was just showing how it works while taking my 4 pt buck with my other hunting "cop" buddies."

Yeah, surrrrrrre, a jury would be on your side.... NOT! An anti gun deputy D.A. might label you as a guy "twisting and using" the system for your own personal follies.... I bet Kamala Harris's new staff would be on your side now, wouldn't they???

Or, even ask yourself, will a DA file charges on you? Will a deputy sheriff/police officer/warden agree with you in the field, or will they arrest you? Is it really worth the risk to take it hunting???? Is it??? What IF you loose your argument? Then what? do you loose your livelyhood to deal in silencers and guns etc... as you currently do?

Again, take a chance if you want to, but I wouldn't risk my livlihood on a technicality such as the question you posted originally. The law seems clear as you point out about using it to demonstrate it to LE. It is NOT clear as evidenced by the many responses here whether you can use if for hunting or not in this state.

Don't get me wrong, I'm pro silencer, pro full auto machine gun for all sane people, but with this nutty state, you really should ask yourself: Are you a gambler??? Is it really worth the risk????

Good luck.

[tenpercentfirearms]

Seems to me that you already "knew" the answer to your question in the first place. So why on earth did you ask it to begin with???

Actually I didn't. I actually got a really good answer off line from a warden that lurks here and he says there is nothing in there. He said just be sure to carry your paperwork with you.

You asked a question and you got several opinions. If you don't want to hear the opinions, then do what you wanna do with your silencer.

You are like a DA. I am refuting your points. I appreciate your help.

I disagree (but who the heck am I?) with the fact that you can "demonstrate to LEO" but how is taking it on a HUNTING TRIPdemonstrating it for a law enforcement official??? Why not "demonstrate" it at a range with paper or steel targets?? Do you really think that in the event a Game Warden decides to hook you up while on your "HUNTING TRIP" , you'll have a jury on your side for that argument?

Let's re-read the code again.

(c) The manufacture, possession, transportation, or sale or other
transfer of silencers to an entity described in subdivision (a) by
dealers or manufacturers registered under Chapter 53 (commencing with
Section 5801) of Title 26 of the United States Code, and the
regulations issued pursuant thereto.

The manufacture, possession, transportation or sale [snip] by dealers or manufacturers registered under Chatper 53 (commencing with Section 5801) of Title 26 of the United States Code, and the regulations issued pursuant thereto. I can legally possess silencers. I can legally transport silencers. I can legally sale silencers. I can legally transfer silencers to entities described in (a).

No where in there does it limit my possession to demonstration purposes only.

Now go read the NFA. Employees can transport, possess, and use NFA items. If I want to see how a suppressor works when shooting feral dogs for police departments, photograph, and video tape it as a demonstration, that is what I am going to do and that is what is legal to do.

Again, take a chance if you want to, but I wouldn't risk my livlihood on a technicality such as the question you posted originally. The law seems clear as you point out about using it to demonstrate it to LE. It is NOT clear as evidenced by the many responses here whether you can use if for hunting or not in this state.

I was incorrect earlier. It says nothing about possessing them to demonstrate them to LE. It clearly says I can possess them and transport them. It is through our debate back and forth that makes me clearer on the law and I do appreciate the discourse.

Don't get me wrong, I'm pro silencer, pro full auto machine gun for all sane people, but with this nutty state, you really should ask yourself: Are you a gambler??? Is it really worth the risk????

I could quote some lines about living free or dieing and be all machismo, but the real facts are I live in Kern County, I know some of the local wardens, and I have never seen a warden here locally in my 25 years of hunting this area. My risk is quite low and even then, I am prepared to make my case. It might be worth my time in the field as I know the Kern County DA isn't going to touch this case with a ten foot pole.

[Shoot-it]

Looks like your good to go .Go out and pop a coyote.

Even the crack of a 223 can damage your hearing over time.I just don't pull the trigger as much when coyote hunting so I don't use ear protection squirrels I do.

[TrailerparkTrash]

...I live in Kern County, I know some of the local wardens, and I have never seen a warden here locally in my 25 years of hunting this area. My risk is quite low and even then, I am prepared to make my case. It might be worth my time in the field as I know the Kern County DA isn't going to touch this case with a ten foot pole.

I personally know the region Lt. and current resident warden for the Isabella area AND the warden north of the lake covering the Greenhorns/Kernville, etc... I also know the retired warden of the isabella area of 17 years. Do you ever hunt around that area?

[tenpercentfirearms]

I personally know the region Lt. and current resident warden for the Isabella area AND the warden north of the lake covering the Greenhorns/Kernville, etc... I also know the retired warden of the isabella area of 17 years. Do you ever hunt around that area?

Very rarely. I got a buck in G6 in 2009. And as someone said earlier, for a big buck hunt like that where performance is everything, I will still probably have my Tikka T3 in .30-06. For all of the hunting on this side of the valley, the 6.5 Grendel would work.

Next time you run into them, run the scenario by them just for the fun of it. I'll post my suppressor cheat sheet when I get around to making it.

[PBRStreetgang]

The majority of people who pull the trigger a lot, via hunting or competitive shooting, shoots with supressors, not for the silent factor, but because of the blast factor. Even with muffs and ear protection, prolonged shooting and the blast of the bullet leaving the muzzle will slowly distroy your hearing. Just saying it's not all hollywood and special ops.

My single biggest reason for owning one before coming back to CA, and leaving it behind was to give my ears a break. With that being said, did anyone figure out what is defined as a Silencer vs Supressor. Best Supressors out there cut it to about 32dB, a long way from being silent. Sticking in a wipe will make it much quieter, and generally found in most "silencers". However a supressor is a different animal, and as such companies like Thompson Machine, GemTech, and SRT Arms won't even use the word "silencer". So there is the question, how is a Silencer defined? The laws get any more confusing, to own anything we going to all need law degrees.

[ke6guj]

CA defintion:

12500. The term "silencer" as used in this chapter means any device or attachment of any kind designed, used, or intended for use in silencing, diminishing, or muffling the report of a firearm. The term "silencer" also includes any combination of parts, designed or redesigned, and intended for use in assembling a silencer or fabricating a silencer and any part intended only for use in such assembly or fabrication.

federal defintion:

(24) The terms "firearm silencer"
and "firearm muffler" mean any device
for silencing, muffling, or diminishing
the report of a portable firearm,
including any combination of parts, designed
or redesigned, and intended for
use in assembling or fabricating a firearm
silencer or firearm muffler, and any
part intended only for use in such assembly
or fabrication.

[PBRStreetgang]

Thanks Jack. I searched a lot of places for that information, glad you had it handy. Looks like it stays in Arizona. It was a great training tool, didn't have to pull out my ear plugs everytime I needed to say something or hear someone when on the line. Always figured it was a absolute no go in California, but when reading all the post I got curious and had to ask. Thanks again.

[TrailerparkTrash]

Next time you run into them, run the scenario by them just for the fun of it. I'll post my suppressor cheat sheet when I get around to making it.

Roger that. I guess if you know it's perfectly legal for you, I say go for it then. Just have a piece of paper or sumthn with you to show the Warden/Deputy Sheriff that you're all good.

I'll ask my buddy and post what he says.....

[sfguyhere]

Not sure if the government already took personal use of these arms into account, but the 5800 sections also fall under the definitions set forth by 18 USC section 921, specifically 921 (21) (C) & (D).

[SFgiants105]

I was just wondering something. You have to pay the tax annually in order to manufacture, sell, transport, or possess silencers.

So does that mean if you decide to stop paying the tax, that you have to forfeit your silencers, sbrs, etc?

[ke6guj]

yup, the yearly SOT is $500 or $1000 depending on the gross sales of the FFL, per year. The fiscal year runs from July 1 to June 30, IIRC.

the CA silencer exemption for SOTs only applies to those that have an active SOT. They would need to sell off any NFA stuff that they will not have an exemption for when the SOT expires.

[tenpercentfirearms]

yup, the yearly SOT is $500 or $1000 depending on the gross sales of the FFL, per year. The fiscal year runs from July 1 to June 30, IIRC.

the CA silencer exemption for SOTs only applies to those that have an active SOT. They would need to sell off any NFA stuff that they will not have an exemption for when the SOT expires.

I am going to start working on my demo videos now. I need to start selling some of this crap!

I also need to start working on some AOWs. Anyone down for having one of these on a sling while coyote calling?

http://www.serbu.com/top/superShorty.php

[tenpercentfirearms]

http://www.facebook.com/video/video.php?v=10150103963262146

[TheMan]

Just out of curiousity, why are you using the .308 suppressor on your 6.5?

AAC makes a 6.5 suppressor. If I could legally, I'd have one on my 6.5 Grendel.

Your setup seems to work well enough in the video, but its hard to get a good feel for the sound reduction in a video compared to in person. I'm curious as to what sort of performance degradation you get from using a suppressor for a larger caliber.