Night vision questions

[TheChief]

Do you have one? If so, what's the make and model, and your opinion of them?

Why do you have\want them?

If someone is looking to buy a set, what would you recommend?

I just picked up a Gen1 monocular from a Big5 for $99. Night Owl xGen 2X Its a toy to play with on some camping trips coming up.

Just wanted people's thoughts on them and suggestion for a real set.

[speedrrracer]

Something like a PVS-14 looks pretty sweet, but it's pretty far down the list.

http://www.opticsplanet.com/l-3-infrared-products-m914-pvs-14-type-nvg-monocular.html

Why would I want one? Just for the appalling advantages I would have in the dark.

Like most of us, I'm overly dependent on my eyesight. With something like a PVS-14, during the dark, it's better than being the only sighted person in a world of blind people, because at least blind people have learned to somewhat compensate...

[DavidR310]

From the readings by several authors, they recommend that if you can afford only one quality nightvision device and have to choose between binos/minos vs rifle mounted scope systems (like a PSV-14) go with the rifle mounted system. Most plans base them on using them in a self defense shtf scenario.

You have the ability to remove the mounted nightvision rifle optic and use it as a standalone scope where you do not have the same versatility with binos/minos and would be difficult at best to use with a firearm system.

[Scuba Steve33]

Holy **** people actually buy NODs?

[dieselpower]

Just remember NV that projects light energy is illegal on a firearm, so any scope with an illuminator is a no-go.

Helmet mounted systems and other ones that strap to your head are actually better since you can walk, drive and scan an area without looking down your firearm. They can also have illuminators and still not be illegal because they are not mounted to a firearm.

No one has ever commented on the legality of a NV scope without an illuminator, but the rifle also having a Surefire and IR filter cap. Unless someone proves otherwise I believe that is also illegal.

[badreligion]

I have used many different types of NVDs over the years. The differences in technology from the mid 90's to today is quite startling. The only way to explain it would be to compare a 1980's color consol tv to the newest high end HD tv.

First you have light gathering optics. I would recommend a gen 3 or better Monoculu that can be weapons mounted like you have already been advised. Besides the fact that they can be hand held, head/helmet mounted and weapons mounted they also have several other advantages. They allow you to have some depth in your field of view, you literally stumble around with NVDs like the AN/PVS-7b as everything is now 2d. If faced with a suddenly lighted area only one eye will be blacked out as the NVD turn off to protect the tube, your not fumbling to rip them off your face to see. When weapons mounted they allow you to use a lower power setting on your optics or use a NV setting, units like the 7b will not allow you to use your sights also. You can mount an IR laser to your weapons and zero it which would allow you to shoot in the dark pretty well.

Besides the cost there are some other downsides too. They will wear out over time from use just like any other electronic device, and are expensive to repair. They can also be damaged or destroyed by direct intense light even for a fraction of a second. Less intense light can activate a protection mode making them useless for a period of time, even reflected light off a white wall, your going to want lights with really lower settings or IR setting or covers. If the NVD unit has the ability to project IR light they cannot be mounted on a rifle in CA. I would not mount a NVD unit on a rifle that has a large flash either as this may turn them off.

Then you have Thermal optics. You can see things that a light gathering NVD will not show you. Everything gives off heat, regardless if its alive or not. The differences in temperature can give you a very clear image that is not effected by light sources. You can see heat rising from a smokeless fire, heat from a recently turned off light bulb, a hidden gun under a lightly clothed person, car exhaust the exhale of someone concealed in the bushes. They are very expensive though and tend to be a much larger unit.

I would love to have several different NVDs for different purposes and can be a very useful item anytime it's dark. They are outside of my price range at this time and pretty far down the list. If anyone wants to give me a nice Gen 3+/4 I wouldn't say no!!!

[winnre]

I know a guy who hinted with night vision on a crossbow. Stay on private property!!!!!

I used plenty of nightvision gear courtesy of Uncle Sam. Get Gen3 or go home. It's the best. Well, there is better but at an extreme cost.

I'd love a set to drive home with and see the road further out, but I found a digital camera works just as well. So I set my camera on the dash and refer to the small screen for what's past the headlights. Kinda cool the camera is that choosy.

[Quiet]

Just remember NV that projects light energy is illegal on a firearm, so any scope with an illuminator is a no-go.

Helmet mounted systems and other ones that strap to your head are actually better since you can walk, drive and scan an area without looking down your firearm. They can also have illuminators and still not be illegal because they are not mounted to a firearm.

No one has ever commented on the legality of a NV scope without an illuminator, but the rifle also having a Surefire and IR filter cap. Unless someone proves otherwise I believe that is also illegal.

CA bans certain types of "night vision scopes". [PC 468]

Summary:
Active IR scope with magnification = illegal
Active IR scope with no magnification = legal
Passive IR scope with magnification = legal
Passive IR scope with magnification and an IR illuminator = illegal
Passive IR scope with no magnifcation = legal
Passive IR scope with no magnification and an IR illuminator = legal
Active IR goggles with magnification = legal
Active IR goggles with no magnification = legal
Passive IR goggles with magnification = legal
Passive IR goggles with magnification and an IR illuminator = legal
Passive IR googles with no magnification = legal
Passive IR goggles with no magnification and an IR illuminator = legal

[Chaparral]

Dont waste money or storage space with anything less than Gen 3, period. End of discussion.

One exception might be an optic that uses the MX-9644 UV tube. It's a pretty big (25mm) diameter tube that gathers a lot of light and makes a pretty decent image.

Thermal is a whole different thing entirely, and i highly recommend it.

[Hot Holster]

I have the Night Owl OX50. I use it for night hog hunting. I would love to have the money to buy a $4k-$5k unit and a NV scope, but I don't.

Using the Night Owl, along with a VRL-1 varmint light (green bulb), I can see and identify targets at over 200 yards. For a cheapy unit, I'm quite pleased with it.

[Dr.Mavashi]

CA bans certain types of "night vision scopes". [PC 468]

Summary:
Active IR scope with magnification = illegal
Active IR scope with no magnification = legal
Passive IR scope with magnification = legal
Passive IR scope with magnification and an IR illuminator = illegal
Passive IR scope with no magnifcation = legal
Passive IR scope with no magnification and an IR illuminator = legal
Active IR goggles with magnification = legal
Active IR goggles with no magnification = legal
Passive IR goggles with magnification = legal
Passive IR goggles with magnification and an IR illuminator = legal
Passive IR googles with no magnification = legal
Passive IR goggles with no magnification and an IR illuminator = legal

Gotta bring this up, this thread was mentioned by Reno dude on YouTube.

Big Brand stores are now selling clip ons California.

I thinking of DNT Hydra or AGN Rattler to go in front of my TA31.

Per above - if I get 1X rattler it should be e fine as it is non magnified and passive, correct ?

[elx144]

All I have right now is a AGM Rattler V2 thermal scope. It has red/white/black/fusion heat profiles. I'm on 40 acres so I use it to scan for predators and to check on my livestock at night.

I don't think they're legal to use as a scope in California, but it has different reticle profiles so I can zero it on different rifles.

I'm looking at Gen2+ PVS-14 but I can't afford that right now.

[Fjold]

...Thermal is a whole different thing entirely, and i highly recommend it.

I gave away my night vision stuff (Gen 2 and older) after I bought my first thermal scanner.

[tacticalcity]

I gave away my night vision stuff (Gen 2 and older) after I bought my first thermal scanner.

I would say it depends on what you are using it for as to whether or not that is a good idea. Awesome as it is, thermal has some downsides to it. The first is that it is not a good option for PID. You can tell it's a person, but all you see is the shape. You cannot tell friend from foe. Which, when hunting is not as important as it is in self-defense, of course. But as a recent episode of Yellowstone correctly pointed out, could actually matter. Yes, I know that is just a TV show but what they showed in that episode was true to life. In that episode they had tags to take out wolves feeding on their herd. However, the wolves they killed had GPS collars. Something thermal could not tell them that night vision would have revealed. That created a political and potentially financial nightmare for them. The odds of you finding yourself in that scenario are slim. But it did accurately demonstrate a big con when it comes to thermal. Another con is battery life. With thermal it is in general significantly less than their non-digital night vision counterparts. They really need to improve that before thermal will be a good leave it on all night long option. For scanning, and for hunting it is great. A real game changer. Just like night vision is a game changer. Personally, I would like to have both. But I want the battery life issue solved. I also want the pricing of a good clip-on to drop down below the cost of my first car. Man, this stuff is expensive. I currently have an OPMOD Gen 3 PVS-14. I think I paid $3500 new. Just for that unit. Not including the rest of the night vision gear which can get very out of hand when it comes to pricing. Next for me will be a set of Gen 3 Binos. But that is a long way off. Too many other priorities. Someday, maybe a thermal clip-on. Most likely something like an iRay so I can use it with my ARs. By then, they will probably invent something better and hopefully more affordable.