Electric dirt bikes/e-bikes ("bicycles") on hiking trails

[Creeping Incrementalism]

I hike a lot on public land in the Bay Area that have always been marked "NO MOTORIZED VEHICLES". But in the past 6 months or so, electric "bicycles" and electric dirt bikes are becoming common -- by that I mean no pedaling even if equipped, it is all hand throttle.

The whole point of these areas is you have to "earn it" with muscle power. Mountain bikers at least have to pedal, and it is hard work to go uphill. Occasionally they go to fast downhill, but it is rarely a problem. But whenever a motor is put on something, the idiocy and danger multiplies 10-fold. Another big factor is going hiking is nice because most hiking trails are not crowded, even when adjoining the suburbs. But as soon as you allow anything motorized, it gets a lot more crowded, even to the point it isn't enjoyable anymore.

It astonishes me that no-pedaling electric bikes & dirt bikes are becoming this common. Only the biggest d-khead would drive a gasoline dirt bike on a 2-lane dirt road where bicycles are allowed, but somehow an electric motor is okay just because it isn't as loud? I get the feeling that if electric cars weren't the trendy thing amongst liberals, then no one would tolerate electric "bicycles" and dirt bikes on hiking trails.

Mountain bikers commonly ride on single-track trails illegally, and I'm already seeing e-bikes and electric dirk-bikes on the same trails, ridden by everyone from snot-nosed 14-year olds, to old geezers.

[Imageview]

Regardless of tools, people who are inconsiderate will find ways to be inconsiderate. I?m not a big ?have to earn it guy?, I earn what I want how I want and I figure other people can do the same, but bikes cause wear differently and pose different safety challenges that need to be accounted for if bikes are allowed. Electric or gas or pedal.

[therealnickb]

Dirks are probably fine if not carried concealed.

[Whiterabbit]

First off, “earn it” is a term for roadie weenies who want to dem their way into being trail fascists alongside the equestrians to fork everyone out of fair multi-use. Forget that term. As far as I am concerned, the equestrians are not earning it either. So ban them too.

Beyond that, if it has a throttle, I’m 100% behind you. Screw them, throw the book at them. Leave us class 1 guys alone.

Taken at face value, I suspect you and I see eye to eye though on about everything. Except this: “But whenever a motor is put on something, the idiocy and danger multiplies 10-fold.”

[Tanner68]

alongside the equestrians to fork everyone out of fair multi-use. Forget that term. As far as I am concerned, the equestrians are not earning it either. So ban them too.

The equestrians totally earn it. It is so much easier to walk than it is to deal with a horse. For example, backpacking is way easier than horse packing. Using horses involves LOTS of extra work. The horse, or mule, only comes into it's own if you have to pack in hundreds of pounds of supplies for a project or protracted stay.

[larkja]

Used to be heavy into mtn biking. Now, I really don't enjoy the effort of huffing it uphill, so I bought an e-bike. I love to explore and it allows me to extend my range and just enjoy being out in nature. Plus, I love how quiet they are.

So, I'm done "earning it." Now I just want to enjoy it. Does this make me a bad person?

[therealnickb]

I rode as much as I could for about 10 years with a good group of guys. One of them developed Parkinson’s a few years ago and could not ride anymore until… he bought an e-bike. Changed his life.

[Big Chudungus]

this is why I want a PHEV motorcycle with a gas motor but also useful pure EV mode.

So it can pretend to be "just an electric bike" and play by those rules when it wants.

[JagerDog]

If the trail is marked "no motorized vehicles", then e-bikes aren't allowed and it should enforced or changed.

Not a fan of previously accessible (by motor vehicle) becoming motorless though. Number of those in a couple boondocking areas I like.

[Creeping Incrementalism]

First off, ?earn it? is a term for roadie weenies who want to dem their way into being trail fascists alongside the equestrians to fork everyone out of fair multi-use. Forget that term. As far as I am concerned, the equestrians are not earning it either. So ban them too.

Beyond that, if it has a throttle, I?m 100% behind you. Screw them, throw the book at them. Leave us class 1 guys alone.

Taken at face value, I suspect you and I see eye to eye though on about everything. Except this: ?But whenever a motor is put on something, the idiocy and danger multiplies 10-fold.?

I don't understand the context or what you mean by "road weenies". Your logic about equestrians make some sense, but as another poster said, there is enough work required by equestrians that there are less of them, and frankly equestrians don't go roaring down trails too fast, or go off-trail much.

My danger multiplied 10-fold comment means -- with electric bicycles, I see about 10 times the amount of bad behavior as I do with regular bicycles.

[Creeping Incrementalism]

If the trail is marked "no motorized vehicles", then e-bikes aren't allowed and it should enforced or changed.

No, that's the point that I learned of only recently -- AB 1096 allows e-bikes on mountain biking trails! And the real-world result is I am coming upon pedal-less dirt bikes on hiking trails all the time now.

Not a fan of previously accessible (by motor vehicle) becoming motorless though. Number of those in a couple boondocking areas I like.

I agree with you 100%, way more than you might guess, on the government shutting down the jeep trails where people used to boondock for decades. What I am talking about is the completely opposite situation: electric motorized vehicles being newly allowed on hiking trails.

[Creeping Incrementalism]

Used to be heavy into mtn biking. Now, I really don't enjoy the effort of huffing it uphill, so I bought an e-bike. I love to explore and it allows me to extend my range and just enjoy being out in nature. Plus, I love how quiet they are.

So, I'm done "earning it." Now I just want to enjoy it. Does this make me a bad person?

For the purposes of trail use, it does. I hate to sound heartless, and I say that realizing that I too will one day be old. But we get old, and that's life, and we just have to enjoy mountain bikes we are young. I don't have much sympathy because the older people today, didn't have to deal with the issue of electric dirk bikes on hiking trails when they were younger. In other words, you can't say, "when I was young, we had to deal with our experience being degraded by older mountain bikers".

Just the other day I saw an older guy riding his electric dirt bike, technically an e-bike except he was gong completely on hand-throttle, down a single-track trail, where all bicycles have always been banned. Whatever the excuse is -- I'm telling you the reality.

It doesn't matter how old someone is, they shouldn't be allowed to interfere wither everyone else's experience in an area that was purchased by taxpayers specifically to be non-motorized.

[Creeping Incrementalism]

Dirks are probably fine if not carried concealed.

Typo in thread title fixed.

[Whiterabbit]

It’s just like guns. You can justify it all you want, but the reason you want to ban them is because you just don’t like them. Equestrians feel the same about you, as you, us.

[AdamVIP]

This seems like a good place to vent my frustrations on non-belled bikes. E-bikes are bringing a slew of new people on to the trails and it appears no one is teaching them to put bells on their bikes to warn hikers. If you want me to get out of your way while you bomb the downhill I'm fine with it but it works a lot better if I can hear you coming before I'm on a blind side curve.