Second Backpacking Trip--more lessons learned, and some not

[Cyberion]

My anchorA view of the typical incline above 6000 feetCool air felt good at the time but the temps dropped quickly above the cloud lineWater level before

Water Source 2

Water level after


Had a great time and will do another hopefully soon. Any advice, coaching, tips or suggestions on tactics or gear are always appreciated.

[KrisDSA]

Great post

[NATEWA]

Thanks for posting. I miss backpacking and look forward to getting out this summer. I have an old MSR whisper lite but think I may try this.

http://www.amazon.com/gp/aw/d/B00CHHT6EU/ref=aw_cm_cr_asin_lnk

[MJB]

sounds like your getting closer........boots are the first thing good boots or don't go. Yes high end may hurt your wallet but if you can't walk your done. REI has some good ones but they are not in stock in the store. Online is the only way to get a boot that fits no slip and will last longer than your legs.

Second if your pack hurts at 35lbs that's not the pack for you. I use Mystry Ranch.....expensive but I can haul 100lbs and go 7 miles packing out mammals I've killed hunting.

Tents that's a gamble 2 man is a 1 man with a little room for gear. I go bivy under 2.5lbs w/rainfly. It's better to go bivy that way if you get seperated both have shelter.

5lbs bag way too heavy half that weight is a must packs small and should hold 20 deg 0 with clothes on.

Water boil Pocket Rocket the only way to go and if you get the titanium pot lid & cup fuel and stove all fit in the sack they give you.

Water filter good choice and good on you finding water the way you did most have no clue. Now the bottle get rid of it and go water bladder with a playterpus(sp) plastic bag bottle as a backup.

Hiking stick or the poles is a must for going up or down much more stable and can use for a shelter pole or chase the Mt lion away or just lean on to rest.

Send me a pm and your number and we can talk......glad your teaching the kid that's huge now a days!

REI info is good but they are for the most part weekend or easy trail guys/gals

I'm a hunter that goes for 2-10 days 3-15 miles in the back country to bow hunt big bucks & elk. I've learned the lessons and willing to share to help you have lees pain & more fun and of course being safe.

I'm going only on a short hunt this weekend in SD 3 miles in no water to filter and damn well better have a buck on my back with my camp before I head out......I'm hoping less than 10 miles total trip but with hunting you never know....

Mark

[Garv]

Look up ultralight backpacking for some ideas to cut weight.

Definitely get lighter sleeping bags when you can.

35 pounds does mean the pack is not right as stated above.
I am usually at 40 - 45.

The pack needs good hip belts that support most of the weight.

[homelessdude]

If you are only spending one night you should be able to get your pack down to twenty to twenty five pounds. How much food did you haul back out? Several friends and I hiked Mt. Whitney last year. Eleven miles to the summit and three miles back down to the upper camp ground. We slept there and hiked the remaining eight miles out the next day. We did the summit of San Jacinto a few months ago and summited San Bernadino peak a couple of weeks ago Seventeen miles in one day. Not many people know about San Bernadino. It is one of the nicest hikes I've ever been on, nice trail, beautiful woods a nice campground if you want it, and not very many people. And a permit is easy to get by mail. Every new guy takes too much stuff, and every hike you find you don't need half of it. There are several websites you can go to that show trails, and campsites and plenty of pics. Only one So Cal mountain left for me " San Gorgonio" and I've been turned down for permits four times in the last few months. Looks like it will have to wait till spring. The more you go the more streamlined your outfit becomes. Keep in mind REI makes a living selling you stuff. Sterno works and the 99 cent store has lots of things you can use. Big five has boots that work, they don't last as long as the expensive ones but there good for several hundred miles. I like to get them a little big and wear two pair of socks with them. A thin pair of hiking socks with a pair of wool ones on the outside. Hope it helps

If I can do it anyone can. I'm 67 years old.

[Tadich]

Nice post, thanks for sharing.

Ketadyn filter and a Jet Boil stove were the two best investments I made when I got into this activity a few years ago.

[renardsubtil]

Some great suggestions here, that's really awesome you're in shape enough to take your son out like that (I wish my dad did this with me).

If your pack is bothering you and you're considering getting a new one, check out REI on a weeknight when it's slow and see if you can get some suggestions from the backpack sales rep, most of them know their stuff and can at least show you some things about packs you can look into.

Plus one on the pocket rocket mentioned above, it's basically a no frills attachment to the fuel canister that screws in and kicks *** at heating water up. The newer isobutane fuel that's out there comes in a nice compact fuel container, relatively cheap, will heat water within minutes no matter than elevation, and can be used a dozen times easily. These are pretty good in windy conditions too but I use a large piece of paper in mine to shield the wind.

Clothing can save you a few ounces (and ounces lead to pounds)...it's worth it to invest in one of those wool base layer shirts (can be pricey) OR the less expensive route is to grab a workout shirt from a local discount retailer, throw a wool sweater over it if you get cold, and then a light weight wind breaker...also a down coat is well worth it, costco sells them for a decent price and REI will have them on sale occasionally - they're usually super light weight and thin enough to throw a rain jacket on top of in case of adverse weather.

[John J]

Never use cotton. Get synthetic everything.

[Cyberion]

Thanks all for the tips and suggestions. Sleeping bag maybe an issue but sounds from ya'll I should look into the backpack. I'll have to test it out around here more because it could be a combination. Maybe I need to replace both. I have stuff hanging on the back of it because there's too little room inside because the sleeping bag. Perhaps weight needs to distributed closer to the body.

Second if your pack hurts at 35lbs that's not the pack for you.

Water boil Pocket Rocket the only way to go...

Send me a pm and your number and we can talk......glad your teaching the kid that's huge now a days!

Mark

Thanks for the offer. I'll PM you next week. Good luck with the hunt this weekend. Care to elaborate on why Pocket Rocket over the Jet Boil? I've heard of both but haven't looked at Pocket Rocket yet.

How much food did you haul back out?
If I can do it anyone can. I'm 67 years old.

I had 3 or 4 Mountain Houses left. Enough for another day. And at 67 good for you! We had a few 70 something year olds blow by us on day hikes. If they weren't going so fast I would asked for a ride. Keep it up!

Jet Boil stove were the two best investments I made when I got into this activity a few years ago.

Jet Boil vs. Pocket Rocket?

Plus one on the pocket rocket mentioned above, it's basically a no frills attachment to the fuel canister that screws in and kicks *** at heating water up.

Another PR vote.

Never use cotton. Get synthetic everything.

I bookmarked this article related to your response the other day-after our hike. Very interesting test. Synthetic good, cotton bad. And I would sure rather read about it than do it. Thank you SEALS.

https://www.sitkagear.com/insight/a-navy-seal-rewarming-drill

[CandG]

Great write-up, I really enjoy reading these!

A few thoughts, so probably already mentioned by others already:

-John J is absolutely right. Cotton is your worst enemy when backpacking. There is no reason to have cotton anything.

-I have a Jetboil Zip, and couldn't possibly recommend it enough. It is the single most valuable upgrade I've made to my backpacking gear in the last 10 years. I like it so much that I bought a spare one just in case.

-Invest in good boots. This is a "buy once cry once" type of thing. If you keep buying $75 boots, you will keep replacing them every season. Look at some $200+ boots like Danners and you will be much happier.

-Ditch the Nalgenes. Each one weighs half a pound EMPTY. Just use 1-liter water bottles, like dasani or whatever.

-Do you like coffee? Grab some Starbucks Via packets from the grocery store. They weigh nothing, just boil up some water in your new Jetboil, dump in a packet, and BAM! now you've got some pretty decent coffee.

-Your <1 mph pace, while on the positive side probably allowed you to enjoy the scenery, is a little on the slow side. My pace was the same for a while. I would suggest doing a bit of running in the off-season. I try to run 1.5 miles at least once a week, and after a few months of that I've found that backpacking is far easier, and thus more enjoyable. You can still hike slow if you want to enjoy the scenery, but you will be happier if you aren't gasping for air and buckling at the knees.


Edit: Also, I own a pocket rocket. It was neat, til I got a jetboil system. Want my old pocket rocket? haha

[Cyberion]

-I have a Jetboil Zip, and couldn't possibly recommend it enough.

-Invest in good boots. This is a "buy once cry once" type of thing. If you keep buying $75 boots, you will keep replacing them every season. Look at some $200+ boots like Danners and you will be much happier.

-Ditch the Nalgenes. Each one weighs half a pound EMPTY. Just use 1-liter water bottles, like dasani or whatever.

-Do you like coffee? Grab some Starbucks Via packets from the grocery store. They weigh nothing, just boil up some water in your new Jetboil, dump in a packet, and BAM! now you've got some pretty decent coffee.

-Your <1 mph pace, while on the positive side probably allowed you to enjoy the scenery, is a little on the slow side. My pace was the same for a while. I would suggest doing a bit of running in the off-season. I try to run 1.5 miles at least once a week, and after a few months of that I've found that backpacking is far easier, and thus more enjoyable. You can still hike slow if you want to enjoy the scenery, but you will be happier if you aren't gasping for air and buckling at the knees.

Edit: Also, I own a pocket rocket. It was neat, til I got a jetboil system. Want my old pocket rocket? haha

Thanks. On boots--I think I paid about $25 from Big 5 a few years ago. Waterproof and they work for walking around...not necessarily hiking.

I've got those Starbucks Via packs. Yes, they work great.

The Nalgenes water bottle is my son's. I wasn't carrying it and not sure why he has it. We do have water bladders. We'll ditch it next time.

<1 mile pace...I started the timer at the bottom and 5 1/2 hrs includes stops and lunch. We were probably going about 2.5 mph but it was hard. I run a few miles a week but at sea level. In any event better conditioning is always good. My son was also huffing and puffing so I was glad it wasn't "just me."

I looked up some references when I got back related to "how long should it take." I'm not sure of the web site but I copied this down. Seems to sort of fit our trip in terms of time expended but I guess experience will tell if it holds for other trips.

Naismith's rule(https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Naismith's_rule) is a good starting point, but it doesn't really cover unusual trail conditions. My rule of thumb is to convert distance, elevation, and trail condition to "equivalent miles":

Each mile is a mile.
Each 500 feet of elevation gain is a mile.
Distance traveled on snow or loose rock counts double.
Distance traveled above 7000 feet elevation counts double.
Distance spent breaking trail counts double.

I figure I can cover three equivalent miles per hour carrying a day pack, or two per hour carrying an overnight pack. The resulting time estimates are usually good to within an hour or so.

[CandG]

In that case your physical conditioning is probably pretty good, so my next suggestion in that case is to acclimate a little when you do a higher elevation hike. If you can, arrive at the elevation the night before the hike so your blood oxygen levels can come to an equilibrium before you start. Pack weight is also a huge factor as you already know, and for a 1 night trip you were probably carrying way more gear than you used. There are some things you'll (hopefully) almost never use but still want to bring, like first aid kit, maybe a firearm, etc. But there are probably many things you didn't use at all that are only in there for convenience, not emergencies. For example, did you bring a change of clothes? Because I'm sure your son could tolerate your stinkiness for 1 day.

Think of as many ways as possibly to use one piece of gear for multiple tasks. For example, a trash bag can serve as a trash bag obviously, but also a poncho, a backpack cover, a rain collector, a bear bag, and so on. Do you have both a GPS and a fancy navigation compass? You should never rely on GPS alone, but a simple little button compass would probably suffice as a backup. I could go on and on forever. Maybe lay out all the gear you took on your trip on your living room floor, and post a photo. I bet the collective of all of our experiences could help you ditch 10lbs of gear without really losing anything you want or costing you a fortune.

[CandG]

One other thing, that sleeping pad is HUGE,... you'd be surprised how comfortable the ground can be if you dig out little grooves in the dirt underneath you for your hip and your shoulder. Done correctly, it feels not unlike a memory foam mattress! Of course, that only works if you know the ground will allow for that at your campsite, but in your case it looks like it would have.

[CandG]

Don't get me wrong, I carry some HEAVY stuff that is totally not necessary. I could use my cell phone camera, but I bring a DSLR with 2 lenses because photography is a really important part of backpacking for me. I could probably leave the scotch and cigars at home too. And I've never had to fire 21 rounds of 10mm at anything, but I sleep better knowing that I could.