some advice needed

[craneman]

Good morning all. I am interested at possibly trying to do some long range shooting and would appreciate any sage advice from anyone with experience. As usual I would like to start with a small budget so that if it does not suit me I am not out mortgaging the farm, so to speak. I should mention that it is still undecided if I would even try competing or just do this for my own satisfaction and enjoyment. Sometimes I think it would be fun to just try to ring a gong out to 1000 or 1200 yards consistently, maybe farther.

My research has led me to think about a Tikka T3 to start with. It sounds as if this is a good compromise to accuracy vs. money spent. I will spend the money for a decent optic as I have noticed the resale is pretty good if taken care of, so I wouldn't be out too much. Not top of the line, but a good middle of the road one. Maybe a Nightforce, or a Vortex Viper maybe?

My questions really are revolving around caliber. Lots of talk about .308 vs. 6.5 creedmore and the 7mm, the 300WM etc, etc...... I have a bunch of .30-06 Springfield stuff already in the safe, and I am a big believer in common calibers within my stable. I also have reloading components for .30-06 already so that helps me.

Is the .30-06 even a viable caliber to use, or is going in this direction just a waste of time and resources? Are the ballistics of the above mentioned rounds that much better, to make it worth while to change calibers or rounds all together? The way I understand it, there is going to be a learning curve involving MY rifle and set-up, and to discover how it reacts to distance wind weather and the like, so I can be repeatable as accurately as possible, right?

So is this just a dumb idea I have to use the .30-06 to try it? Now mind you, that for the last 35 years I have never sold a gun I have bought as I kinda like to keep them. I don't know why this is, as I have a bunch that get shot very little. Evidently it must be some kind of sickness.

Sorry for the long post, and thanks for any advice you can give to me.

[highpower790]

If your considering competition,know that palma shooters use the 223 and 308win.The 06 will work well enough to send bullets down range although not the best choice.Of the cartridges listed the 6.5 would probably be the best but not a legal palma rifle caliber.
If your near Sacramento there is a clinic coming in April...calguns member Ahhnother8 puts this on.

[craneman]

Thanks for the reply highpower. I am in the San Diego area so the clinic would be a bit far, but thank you again for the info. As I said, I am not too sure if competing is for me or not. I didn't even think about if the .30-06 would not be able to qualify if I did decide to try it. I guess as you said it would be OK for just going out to ring the gong, but there are better choices. I need to find out what makes the others better and by how much better. Is it even possible to compensate for its shortcomings?

I have a lot to learn. Heck, I need to search for the Palma rifle caliber, as I do not know what "Palma" is or encompasses.

[highpower790]

Palma is a course of fire that takes place at 800-1000yds,slow fire.Usually 15 or 20 shots per string in a time limit of 15 or 20 min,223 or 308 allowed.Ckeck out Santa Margarita gunclub..they have matches on Camp Pendleton.If you see what others use and what others use there rifles for this could help you.

[craneman]

Well I just returned from reading about the Santa Margarita Gun Club. Thanks for the advice! I do have a Garand so I could compete with that if I decided to do a competition. Although open iron sights with my aging eyes and an even older barrel might be tricky, but it sounds like fun. It sounds a bunch like the rifle qual I did every year while I was in the Corps. Without the 500 yard part, and I would have to pull targets in the butts. Ah, the memories.

I also have a much better understanding of what a Palma Match is, so I guess the .30-06 and the optic is out.

I might try to go to the clinic next weekend if it is not too late. Thanks again!

[highpower790]

Well I just returned from reading about the Santa Margarita Gun Club. Thanks for the advice! I do have a Garand so I could compete with that if I decided to do a competition. Although open iron sights with my aging eyes and an even older barrel might be tricky, but it sounds like fun. It sounds a bunch like the rifle qual I did every year while I was in the Corps. Without the 500 yard part, and I would have to pull targets in the butts. Ah, the memories.

I also have a much better understanding of what a Palma Match is, so I guess the .30-06 and the optic is out.

I might try to go to the clinic next weekend if it is not too late. Thanks again!

You could use a hooded national match ap with a diopter,this would help see a service rifle post.Check Creedmoor Sports or Bob Jones sights.
PAC Fleet matches are coming up(late April)....just something to think about

[Fjold]

Thanks for the reply highpower. I am in the San Diego area so the clinic would be a bit far, but thank you again for the info. As I said, I am not too sure if competing is for me or not. I didn't even think about if the .30-06 would not be able to qualify if I did decide to try it. I guess as you said it would be OK for just going out to ring the gong, but there are better choices. I need to find out what makes the others better and by how much better. Is it even possible to compensate for its shortcomings?

I have a lot to learn. Heck, I need to search for the Palma rifle caliber, as I do not know what "Palma" is or encompasses.

Typically "better" is hard to define but let me add some things to consider.

The 30.06 is a good cartridge but on the target range it performs best with long heavy bullets so you pay the penalty with increased felt recoil.

Generally, better is usually associated with chamberings that shoot long sleek, bullets with high Ballistic Coefficients. Ballistic Coefficient (or BC) is a number rating that give a value to a bullet's resistance to slowing due to air resistance. The easier the bullet cuts through the air, the higher the Ballistic coefficient.

Lately there has been a trend to shoot shorter, cartridges of small diameter in the 243 - 264 calibers because the long sleek bullets have a high BC without a high weight so felt recoil is less. With these long bullets you need to make sure that the barrel twist is fast enough to stabilize them so most match guns run twists around 1 turn in 8 inches (1:8") with some 1:7.5" and some up to 1:10" in the big caliber guns.

At the 1,000 yard and further ranges the bigger calibers , including the 284, 30, 338, up through 50 caliber rule as the heavier bullets are less susceptible to wind deflection.

[JMP]

Any of the cartridges you listed will be able to hit steel at 1,200 yards, even the .308 if you have a sturdy load and long barrel.

If you are budget constrained, get a Remington 700 in .308. With a barrel change to a good high performance barrel you can shoot .243 Win, 6 Creed, 260 Rem, 6.5 Creed, 6.5 Lapua, and the list goes on and on.

If you have a little more money, there are a couple of AI MKIIIs still on the market in .243 Win.

http://www.eurooptic.com/accuracy-international-ae-mk-iii-243-winchester-26-inch-plain-bbl-black-fixed-stock.aspx

That rifle will kick the **** out anything you mentioned. It'll be perfect out of the box, and you can rechamber later is .243 doesn't give you sufficient barrel life.

Of course, if you plan to do real long range (mile+), I'd recommend a .338 Lapua, MINIMUM. Those little short actions cartridges really poop out after about 1,400 yards, and you won't be making hits with a .308 since it will be key-holing.

[LynnJr]

You already have a 30-06 so I wouldn't do anything until you shoot it at 1000 yards to see how much you like it. You can put a muzzlebrake on it if the recoil bothers you and you don't gain anything by going 308. The only reason anyone would use a 308 is because the rules dictate its use as mentioned earlier.
You won't find a 308 in any unlimited form of 1000 yard and beyond shooting.
If you reload get a box or two of the 175 Sierra MatchKings and start ringing some steel. If you get bored with that you can rebarrel the 30-06 to a different cartridge more suited to your intended goal.
The three most important things to longrange accuracy are the barrel the barrel and the barrel.

[craneman]

Thank You all for the replies and good advice. I didn't want you all to think I was ignoring this after I started it, but I woke up this morning and found my wife of 27 years in really bad shape. I spent all day at the hospital and she survived brain surgery this morning, but it is touch and go for the next who knows how long. Long distance shooting, or any shooting for that matter, is on indefinite hold for a while. Priorities have suddenly changed and I find my self typing this through blurry tearful eyes. Thanks again.

[milotrain]

Do what's important. Shooting can always happen later. Sorry to hear about your wife but it's excellent that she made it through surgery. Prayers