Auto sear pocket and pivot hole laws/code?

[mkodama]

Yes, I know full auto firearms and their parts are illegal, and get up to a $10,000 fine and up to 10 years in prison, lose your right to own guns, and vote.

I'm curious more about the details when making a rifle from an 80% AR15 lower with cosmetic similarities to an M16.

1. Is there anything unlawful with cutting out a fire control pocket similar to the M16 in shape? The M16 pocket is more simple to cut, being a large rectangle compared to the AR15's indescribable shape, which saves time and effort, as well as saves weight.
ex:
AR15 pocket: http://www.quarterbore.com/images/ar15nosear001.jpg
M16 pocket: http://www.quarterbore.com/images/nfa-ar15rr-02.jpg

2. Is there anything unlawful about making a hole that provides similar appearances to a full auto sear pin hole, but sized and located differently to prevent use of a full auto sear?

The only code I see these getting close to is the definition of a machinegun, but since there is no change in function, nor parts that can be installed, there is no problem with these modifications.

[1lowluv]

i used to think M16 style was easier to cut too. but now ive done so many i just cut them AR style. takes me like an extra minute or 2. you can cut it how ever you like, just dont drill that hole. also make sure you only gut the top shelf without the offset. if you dont offset where the saftey goes through you will mill into the hole for the safety detent. ask me how i know. lol

[edgerly779]

I milled out the safety detent pocket myself on one of my 80%ers still works ok now I leave the small island where the detent is.Only takes a few minutes more.

[kcstott]

don't drill the third hole don't spot it engrave it or anything. Internet rumor has it that people have gotten into some very deep trouble for so much as spotting the hole to install the head of a pin to get the look.

ATF say once the hole is marked it is "able to be readily converted"

[RickD427]

I would be very careful with this one.

ATF's posture has been that something either "is" or "is not" a firearm. That same posture is easily extended to the determination that a firearm "is" or is "not" an automatic firearm. They have never subscribed to the "80%" definition and have never provided a clear understanding of where the demarcation line lies in the construction of a firearm. All you can do is submit an exemplar, and they'll tell what side of the line it falls on. California DOJ isn't so accommodating. They generally will not respond to a determination request from a private person.

On top of all that, both the federal and state definitions of an automatic firearm are broadly written to include conditions where an automatic firearm could be readily created, without having actually created the firearm.

The milling of the trigger group pocket on the semi-auto AR-15 was intentionally done to prevent the ready conversion of the receiver to full auto through the simple swapping of parts. Milling the M-16 pattern puts you closer to the line of having a full-auto. As the previous poster stated, locating and/or drilling the third hole puts you even another step closer (and probably well over) the line.

Once you "cross the line" you're a felon. They will not tell you where the line lies. You know that you're on the "good" side of the line with a traditional AR-15 build. Given those uncertainties, I would not want to venture in the direction of the "wrong" side of the line.

The weight savings is going to be negligible. If you can't duplicate the milling pattern of the AR-15, then you probably don't have the machining skills to adequately finish the 80% build.

[ke6guj]

there are factory AR lowers that are sold with an M16-pocket. just because some vendors choose to mill non-milspec pockets to prevent auto-sears and DIAS's from being installed doesn't mean that they legally have to do so. they are making a company decision to CYA.

[1lowluv]

i seen one of the .22 ARs at big 5 and it had a #rd pin engraved into it for looks. i think it was the colt version

[mkodama]

Good responses.

Consensus seems that M16 pocket is reasonable, but a modified location/diameter auto sear hole is still very questionable/risky.

[ke6guj]

i seen one of the .22 ARs at big 5 and it had a #rd pin engraved into it for looks. i think it was the colt version

IIRC, the colt (umarex) .22lr uses an entirely different FCG design so even if that indicated hole was drilled, it wouldn't make it a machinegun because you wouldn't be able to put an M16 FCG into it.