80% Completion Laws

[Jason95357]

No at the end of that thread they say they are not taking any more customers.


"I said good day!"

Being able to do it all in your own home, as often and as many as you want is the best.

http://www.80percentarms.com/

[j-shot]

Unfortunately those type of people could ruin it for the rest of the people that want to build them for personal use, legally. In the end it will make it a lot more difficult for EVERYONE.

Now SB 808 is just hideous...and I wonder how they would enforce the 2016 deadline to register and serialize ALL firearms manufactured for personal use with no serial numbers. There is surely millions of them and I don't see that happening, so in the end they will most likely need to "grandfather" them in. Eventually "we the people" need to get our 2A rights back which we have been infringed on.

Good for you, I have my own equipment and don't plan to have anyone help me, nor do I plan to help others...other than online.

To me the law is pretty clear, and I don't see anything wrong with doing it yourself as it was intended. Anyone will appreciate it that much more. People can still help others learn how to perform specific tasks, just can't do it for them.

Or more interesting, what would they do if they all had the same serial number...?

On "registration day" agent takes note of your rifle. Type, AR-15. Serial number, 2-FU-CA. Thanks, next.

Type, AR-15. Serial number, 2-FU-CA. Thanks, next.

Type, AR-15. Serial number, 2-FU-CA. hmmmm

[krwada]

Here is an ATF affidavit posted in the other thread. It lists the federal codes that the shops are going to be charged with for completing 80% lowers.
Renting out machines and time to complete firearms as a source of income at the business location would result in similar charges for the same codes.
Note that the very expensive machines involved will be seized, any machine shop contemplating doing this at this point in time needs a physiological examination.

http://www.justice.gov/usao/cae/news...%20Package.pdf

physiological examination??? You mean like a prostate exam?

OK ... I think you meant psychological examination ... like talking to a social worker or shrink right?

ummm... maybe talking to a social worker is not OK. I heard that almost all social workers are left-wing liberals.

[fbuccino]

Ok, so I love a good argument. From reading the Cortez case, these guys were obviously making guns to sell illegally. Also guys were making and machining their own 80% blanks in the same building.
What I didn't see was were a machine shop can't rent their CNC mill. They are not manufacturing lowers. The renter of the mill is doing the work and if it is strictly for his own use, what's the problem? Everyone keeps referring to this case, but what these guys are doing is totally different than renting a CNC machine.
Is there a specific law that states a machine shop can't rent it's equipment to a person so they can finish a lower?

[Ashick]

This seems like a bigger problem in CA. Maybe because I frequent these forums much more. Have the BATFE raided similar shops in let's say AZ?

[kcstott]

Ok, so I love a good argument. From reading the Cortez case, these guys were obviously making guns to sell illegally. Also guys were making and machining their own 80% blanks in the same building.
What I didn't see was were a machine shop can't rent their CNC mill. They are not manufacturing lowers. The renter of the mill is doing the work and if it is strictly for his own use, what's the problem? Everyone keeps referring to this case, but what these guys are doing is totally different than renting a CNC machine.
Is there a specific law that states a machine shop can't rent it's equipment to a person so they can finish a lower?

Actually you read over it. one of the charges is "in the business of manufacturing". that is receiving compensation for the use of the tools. Renting leasing, borrowing or other wise using someone else's tooling is verboten

That is what the fuss is about.

[leok20]

Yeah the Cortez brothers should be hung. $25000 SBR deals. These guys were illegally undocumented gun making idiots. When they were milling it up for the customer. Slapping the kits all together for them they should be carted off. They were breaking the law before guns even got involved. These guys might be cartel types who knows.


"I said good day!"

[Eagle Eyes]

Now you know why the BATF&E has been coming down hard on machine shops and others making "80%" stuff.

These are the types of morons that ruin it for the rest of us that do follow the law. I will bet the BATF&E already has cases lined up in LA and SD for the same stupid stuff.

[fbuccino]

kcstott, thanks. That's what I was wondering about.

On another note, the BATF raided ARES today in San Diego and took customer names DESPITE a court order not to.
It seems strange when only the people have to follow the laws and the government doesn't.