Quick zip gun question

[_Z_]

Okay so I am trying to understand the zip gun law and what is a zip gun. Would a hybrid of a sten/cetme something built into a pistol form be considered a zip gun?

Thanks

edit: uploaded what i was talking about

[B Strong]

Okay so I am trying to understand the zip gun law and what is a zip gun. Would a hybrid of a sten/cetme something built into a pistol form be considered a zip gun?

Thanks

That's some hybrid...

Delayed-blowback recoil operated combined with an open bolt advanced primer ignition.

I'd be more concerned with the NFA before worrying about Ca. state "ZG" regs.

[_Z_]

uploaded picture in first post

[chiz]

I am working on something similar but with an m11 upper. I want it to look something like this.



I dont think it would be a problem since you are using a design all ready in use but are modifying it.

Also I love ideas like this. I have tons of ideas and parts laying around and need to get some of them finished.

Also read this.

[_Z_]

I am working on something similar but with an m11 upper. I want it to look something like this.




Also read this.

I saw that thread..

the main quote is I DONT THINK doesn't mean it is correct but I am just trying to figure out where we are a year later if things changed and what not

I'm not feeling that stock if it is stuck in that position.

[chiz]

I'm not feeling that stock if it is stuck in that position.

I'm not using it.


The way i see it is that you are building a sten (Because that is the receiver)and you are changing the grip.

[G-forceJunkie]

As long as it looks like a firearm, and meets all the other legal requirements on length/features/etc I would not call it a zip gun. "zip gun" usually implys a firearm, disguised to not look like a firearm such as a briefcase MP5, walking cane shotgun, etc.

[xenophobe]

Open bolt = bad.

[Roccobro]

Pen gun= disposable. As those once made from ink pens.

Saturday night special= gun that has low retail price. Ghey in interpretation by legislature.

These items and others that fall under PC 12020 section as prohibited in CA do not apply to a well thought out design, or re-manufacture of a design sold as parts. (found in Government Code)

I don't see anything remotely close to "disposable" or "cheap" in regards to the firearms and concepts in this thread.

Justin

[GuyW]

I don't see anything remotely close to "disposable" or "cheap" in regards to the firearms and concepts in this thread.

Quaint - but the terms "disposable" and "cheap" are conspicuously absent in the CA law.

[ke6guj]

12020(c)(10) As used in this section, a "zip gun" means any weapon or device which meets all of the following criteria:
(A) It was not imported as a firearm by an importer licensed pursuant to Chapter 44 (commencing with Section 921) of Title 18 of the United States Code and the regulations issued pursuant thereto.
(B) It was not originally designed to be a firearm by a manufacturer licensed pursuant to Chapter 44 (commencing with Section 921) of Title 18 of the United States Code and the regulations issued pursuant thereto.
(C) No tax was paid on the weapon or device nor was an exemption from paying tax on that weapon or device granted under Section 4181 and Subchapters F (commencing with Section 4216) and G (commencing with Section 4221) of Chapter 32 of Title 26 of the United States Code, as amended, and the regulations issued pursuant thereto.
(D) It is made or altered to expel a projectile by the force of an explosion or other form of combustion.

note that in order to be a zip gun, all of the items must apply. If you copy an existing design, then (B) isn't valid, and it can't be a zip gun. Others have opined that (C) only applies to NFA items, and that homebuilt Title 1 firearms are exempt from having to have tax paid on them, so (C) would not apply to any title 1 firearm. If (C) didn't apply, then it woudldn't be a zip gun.

[Roccobro]

Quaint - but the terms "disposable" and "cheap" are conspicuously absent in the CA law.

Never said they were.

Justin

[GuyW]

Never said they were.

Whatever that means.

The OPs proposed gun does NOT resemble a single commercially-sold firearm.

Hence, my conservative view that its at risk of being IDd as a zipgun.
.

[_Z_]

Whatever that means.

The OPs proposed gun does NOT resemble a single commercially-sold firearm.

Hence, my conservative view that its at risk of being IDd as a zipgun.
.

Just to BE CLEAR I DO NOT HAVE THE FIREARM IN MY POST.

I don't need someone knocking on my door because they assume something.

I asked if it was legal to see if it was legal or not in CA

I mean JPGLee got an "ok" for his hybrid AK something design .

[Roccobro]

Whatever that means.

The OPs proposed gun does NOT resemble a single commercially-sold firearm.

Hence, my conservative view that its at risk of being IDd as a zipgun.
.

Where in the PC does it say it has to be a "commercially-sold firearm"?

My answer was to the "spirit of the law" definition of a Zip gun. The kind taught to new recruits. given the same reasoning the zip guns are listed next to "cane guns", "pen guns" and all other guns that do not look like a firearm from the outside in the Penal Code. Sorry if I confused you with my post.

Justin