WEGC : LESA vs 3 Gun

[DLM]

Has anyone shot the LESA and 3 gun at WEGC. What is the difference??

[mbauer67]

The LESA group often shoots more challenging stages, and more geared towards a pistol match with a rifle side match. Both groups are good to shoot with and help first timers have a good time. I might actually shoot both matches this month.

[Saym14]

yes. I shoot both. 3gun is geared more to the USPSA rules. LESA is great if you really want to push your skill , mental and physical limits more. it is more challenging on several levels. also in LESA the rifle can be shot optional. the WEGC action pistol is good too if you want to shoot 5 stages of handgun and one shotgun

[SuperSet]

Not just to be different but I actually think they're really similar since they use the same bays, same props and I see the same folks at both matches. I kinda wondered why there were 2 3gun matches at West End when I first started shooting there.

[Ronin2]

The LESA match is NOT an official 3 gun match. The rifle portion is optional. The official match scores all five combat pistol/shotgun stages. The rifle stages with are as said above, optional ( you only need pistol and shotgun to shoot and get scored for the match) and they are imbedded into two if the existing pistol/shotgun stages.

everyone, members and non members alike are encouraged to come out and shoot. Firs timers are encouraged and helped along as needed. If you need to borrow a shotgun or rifle there is always someone willing to do that. Find me and I'll lend anyone who needs it my shotgun /rifle.


The guys running the LESA have been doing this for over 15 years together.

Be advised, I am trying to get the West End Gun Club to institute higher match fees for non NRA members. I hope to bring this up at the next board meeting to see if there is any support for it.

Fees for the match currently are;

Non WEGC members : $20
WEGC members : $10

Anyone who shows up early to help set up gets a $5 discount on their match fee,

See you there....

[CGT80]

IIRC, LESA is graded on IPSC targets for each zone hit. A zone is 0 seconds added, C=1, and D=3 seconds. 3 gun is single A zone or two hits anywhere to neutralize.

LESA doesn't have a Kalifornia Kompliant division and 3 gun does. I shoot featureless and 10 round mags. Sometimes people will use bullet button guns.

Why have two matches that both use 3 guns? Because they are fun to shoot and the people are great, that is why.

George runs the LESA match and he is very good about making it challenging. We seem to alternate between having all embedded rifle stages and having a 150-180 yard rifle stage in the back. His long range rifle stages seem to really test the skills of most shooters.

Come out and shoot both. The matches are both very fun and organized. We average 20-35 people so the match moves at a nice pace.

Action pistol is fun, but with an average of 40-60 people, the squad sizes are big and it takes longer to complete the match.

If you have a lever action gun, check out the lever action silhouette at West End as well. It isn't at all like the cowboys competitions. Shooting rifle in 3 gun/LESA has helped to make lever action an easy game to pick up.

[DLM]

Thanks all!!!
I think I'll give the LESA a try this month.

DLM

[Religious Shooter]

I started shooting 3 Gun at WEGC when Mike S. was the MD around 2000. The 3 Gun match at WEGC had already been there for years prior.

LESA was first at Norco but moved to WEGC (where the 3 Gun match already existed).

3 Gun and LESA at WEGC are both outlaw. Neither of them are USPSA.

[Ronin2]

3 Gun and LESA at WEGC are both outlaw. Neither of them are USPSA.

And thank god for that. Less gaming.....more fun!

[Leethe4th]

I started shooting 3 Gun at WEGC when Mike S. was the MD around 2000. The 3 Gun match at WEGC had already been there for years prior.

LESA was first at Norco but moved to WEGC (where the 3 Gun match already existed).

3 Gun and LESA at WEGC are both outlaw. Neither of them are USPSA.

LESA used to run out of a range off Railroad Canyon, north of the I-15 in Lake Elsinore. It was orignally the Lake Elsinore Shooting Association. A housing track forced them out the in late 90's or so. Then they became the Limited Extreme Shooting Association. Not only did George run a great match, on time, with tons of shooters, torn down, scored and prize pins awarded by 2pm. He also used to run a SKS only match.

And outlaw doesn't mean no rules. Superstition Mystery Mountain, Rocky Mountain and Iron Man are all 'outlaw' matches. They have plenty of written rules, but not 100 pages like when USPSA created their multigun. Local matches usually don't have written rules, but use USPSA targets scored by time plus points and gun divisions loosely based on USPSA multigun.

[Ronin2]

LESA used to run out of a range off Railroad Canyon, north of the I-15 in Lake Elsinore. It was orignally the Lake Elsinore Shooting Association. A housing track forced them out the in late 90's or so. Then they became the Limited Extreme Shooting Association. Not only did George run a great match, on time, with tons of shooters, torn down, scored and prize pins awarded by 2pm. He also used to run a SKS only match.

Actually the Lake Elsonore Sportsmans Association was not forced out by development but rather when one of the two landlords died and his heirs wanted to "cash out" of the estate and sell all the land. The dead mans partner did not want to buy out the estate and so the property was sold and used as wildlife habitat abatement property by a local developer. The range property sits much as it was when we were kicked off. In fact the developer would not even let the club return and cleanup the lead. Thus we were able to transfer the +/- $75k in the LESA lead cleanup fund ( we were always hoping to find land to buy one day) to West End Gun Cub to provide the down payment for WEGc to purchase its land before it too became wildlife habitat abaitment land. The LESA board that donated that money to WEGC included Stewart Wilson, Terry Algren (current WEGC treasurer), George Zagurski (current WEGC LESA match director), Mike Kirley, Max Joseph (owner TFTT.com), Bill Flory (WEGC junior program director), Bob LaPointe (range officer rainbow range, temecula) and myself.

And outlaw doesn't mean no rules. Superstition Mystery Mountain, Rocky Mountain and Iron Man are all 'outlaw' matches. They have plenty of written rules, but not 100 pages like when USPSA created their multigun. Local matches usually don't have written rules, but use USPSA targets scored by time plus points and gun divisions loosely based on USPSA multigun.

Yup. More time spent shooting/training and less time squabbling and crying about the rules. As noted above...just more good, challenging shooting problems with a great group of people, most of whom have been shooting this monthly match together for over 15 years.

[Leethe4th]

Yea, I went by there a few months ago, and everything is still as it was, except for the shooting. I though Stewart Wilson left the county?

[Ronin2]

Yea, I went by there a few months ago, and everything is still as it was, except for the shooting. I though Stewart Wilson left the county?

Yeah, Stu relocated to a free state .... He is living outside of Prescott Az. Still smithing .45's, accurizing / building AR-10's and AFAIK, still a champion .50 cal long range shooter.

[Religious Shooter]

And outlaw doesn't mean no rules. Superstition Mystery Mountain, Rocky Mountain and Iron Man are all 'outlaw' matches. They have plenty of written rules, but not 100 pages like when USPSA created their multigun. Local matches usually don't have written rules, but use USPSA targets scored by time plus points and gun divisions loosely based on USPSA multigun.

Where did you get that "outlaw" means no rules?

[Leethe4th]

Where did you get that "outlaw" means no rules?

Where did you get what you said from?

Read what I said

Originally Posted by Leethe4th
And outlaw doesn't mean no rules.