Test loads, does it need to at 100 yards?

[gemini1]

I'm working on loads for a 55 grain fmjbt and Benchmark, and then I wondered,
if I'm just testing loads, finding the right node, why do I need to shoot at 100 yards? If wind is a factor to consider when looking for accuracy, wouldn't it make sense to shoot at 50 or even 25 yards?

[damndave]

From my understanding, it takes a 55gr bullet roughly 50-75 yrds to stabilize. Mostly depends on twit rate and velocity.

[GeoffLinder]

It is completely useless to try and determine accuracy at less than 100 yards and not even a very good test until you get to 200 yards or more. Most anything will print well at 25-50 yards. It takes a decent distance to get a real handle on actual group sizes.

Wind is not a factor at 100, even at 200 it is no big thing unless it is constantly shifting. Some ranges have side berms which minimizes this in some cases. If it is an open range, then you need to do testing on days when wind is not present or is constant.

[Dark Mod]

Ive always felt that it should be far enough away that accuracy differences would be obvious, but close enough that wind and other factors arent an issue.

between 75 to 250 yards is probably right about where you want to be. I use 100 yards because its easy to shoot consistantly at. When my front sight post obscures the target at 200+ my shooting gets less consistant.

Wind isnt going to have much effect on a bullet at 100 yards and under unless its a damn strong crosswind. You should time your shooting to coincide with wind conditions anyway, at farther distances the wind becomse more of a factor.

Be prepared to break out the micrometer if your shooting at 25 yards though

[HighLander51]

My zero for all my 3 Gun rifles is 35/300 yards. I get it within an inch or so at 35, then make the final adjustment at 300.

[BLR81]

I'm working on loads for a 55 grain fmjbt and Benchmark, and then I wondered,
if I'm just testing loads, finding the right node, why do I need to shoot at 100 yards? If wind is a factor to consider when looking for accuracy, wouldn't it make sense to shoot at 50 or even 25 yards?

It depends on what the right node means to you.

The ladder test for me tells me where I can find consecutive loads that shoot Vertically in the same area. Wind may affect the shots horizontally but I don't care if the shot vary left to right. Meaning if my ladder test is in increments of 0.3-0.5 grains, and the shots group closely together, then I can be sure that when reloading if I'm off in powder drops from 0.1-0.2 grains, I'm not going to see a great deal of change in elevation.

If I shooting a sub-moa rifle or even just a 1 moa rifle, shots varying in powder weight of 0.3grains, really are going to be pretty close especially at 100yds. And, I have to be absolutely certain that I'm not putting any affect on shot location thru bad marksmenship or the test has no value.

So, I run my ladder tests at 300yds and would use a greater distance if I had access to a range that went out farther. A 0.5 grain change in weight will cause about a 25 fps change in muzzle velocity. At the most that will change the bullet drop only 0.4-0.5" at 300 yds, and less than half that at 100yds.

When I find a node that fits my need, then I'll run a OCW style test in 0.1-0.2 grain increments to find the most accurate weight. But then I'm looking for the tightest 5 shot group. By narrowing the node down to say 3 consecutive load weights to start with using the ladder test, I can run my OCW test and cover the middle 1 grain of the node with 5 groups in 0.2 gr increments.

So, using 14-20 shots with my ladder test I can usually test from the load data minimum to maximum loads and, I can find the best node for running my 5 shot group accuracy tests. That's less than 50 shots.

[ExtremeX]

I find it completely useless to load dev at 25 or 50 yards... even junk loads seem to print well at those distance and it’s very difficult to identify the good from the bad.

I generally do a preliminary ladder at 100 yards, and then push it out farther.

If I am developing a load to shoot at 300 yards then it’s also kind of short sighted to just stick with my best 100 yard results and not test or tune that ladder at the distances I intend to run it.

[Fjold]

A 55 grain fmj at a muzzle velocity of 3,000 fps will drift about 1.1 inches at 100 yards in a 10 mph (90 degree) cross wind.

When shooting for accuracy 1.1" is huge.

[emptybottle151]

I normally shoot between 25-200yds and mostly at 100yds, so when I reload I test at 100yds.

[gemini1]

I see, okay that answers it. Now let me ask your opinion about using powders that normally are used on lighter bullets, but has data for heavier ones as well (like H335 & Benchrest). So is it a waste of components to try either powder on heavier bullets? It just that I still could not find (at decent price) the ones recommended for 69 and up grainers, and I'm itching to try a few 77s I have with those powders. Also, is a 100 yards good enough to develop loads for the heavies grainers?

[GeoffLinder]

Varget is a great powder for 69-80 grain bullets but maybe not the best choice for 55gr. AA2520 will work very well for 55gr-77gr. WW748 is very good under 55gr-69gr. There are others, but these are what I have found best for me.

No matter what you hear, testing at 100 yards or less for accuracy, especially with heavies like 77gr is not an optimum distance. 200 yards is barely enough distance to really see how groups are really developing. At 100 yards a 77gr is still waggling it tail and not quite spin stabilized yet so it will actually cut a slightly exaggerated hole in the target face and widen groups up a little. If you can find a good range, 300 yards is best, 200 is workable, 100 is barely good enuff for proper 55gr testing and 25-75 yards is useless except for getting a rifle on paper when checking an initial zero.

[LynnJr]

I'm working on loads for a 55 grain fmjbt and Benchmark, and then I wondered,
if I'm just testing loads, finding the right node, why do I need to shoot at 100 yards? If wind is a factor to consider when looking for accuracy, wouldn't it make sense to shoot at 50 or even 25 yards?

If your looking for a node you are only looking for several consecutive rounds with very little vertical stringing.You are not concerned with horizontal stringing when looking for a node.
If you have a headwind or tailwind this will give your shots vertical stringing and affect you results.Crosswinds have less affect on vertical.

A "Ladder Test" with a hunting type rifle is often times difficult to decipher.The typical rifle you would find at most public ranges have very heavy trigger pull weights meaning it it is easy to move the gun when firing.
Next most shooters don't have rest systems available them that properly fit most stocks.
Next would be the scope.On benchrest rifles scopes generally run 36-60 power and have thin crosshairs and small dots.The advantage is you can easily aim at the same point for all your shots.
The typical 3X9 scope has immense crosshairs that cover up way to much of the target making subsequent shot at the same point of aim very difficult.

To help your chances at a successful test Use a blank sheet of paper or turn your target around backwards so it is all blank.You can put a piece of colored Duct Tape on it several inches wide and a second piece that forms a "T" shape.This will allow you to align your crosshairs on the edges of the tape and get better repeatability.

Next use alot of sandbags.If you don't have any you can fill the leg of an old pair of jeans with rice.popcorn or dry beans and simply tie off both ends with string.This is a cheap makeshift approach but it will work in a pinch.5 or 6 bags will help.

Never rest the barrel of your gun on anything.I see guys doing a "Ladder Test" with there barrel on the bags and the groups are tremendously large.

On the trigger there isn't you can do there unless you know someone who will lend you a trigger with a light pull weight.

On my hunting rifles I develop my loads with a 45 power scope and 2 ounce trigger and after the load is good I switch back to standard hunting type parts.

[gemini1]

Good to know, thank you guys. One last question, about bullet brand/type. If I was able to find the sweet spot/node of say brand X fmjbt, will the same sweet node/spot be the same if I get a the same fmjbt from brand Y? or must I at prepare a few test rounds thats +/- a couple of grains?

[Fjold]

Good to know, thank you guys. One last question, about bullet brand/type. If I was able to find the sweet spot/node of say brand X fmjbt, will the same sweet node/spot be the same if I get a the same fmjbt from brand Y? or must I at prepare a few test rounds thats +/- a couple of grains?

Different brands of bullets will usually give different results, sometimes grossly different. It's very rare that different brands of bullets will shoot accurately into the same POA,

[ExtremeX]

Good to know, thank you guys. One last question, about bullet brand/type. If I was able to find the sweet spot/node of say brand X fmjbt, will the same sweet node/spot be the same if I get a the same fmjbt from brand Y? or must I at prepare a few test rounds thats +/- a couple of grains?