First handloaded rounds - ever!

[bruss01]

Ok, I had a huge post typed in about my experience as a first time handloader, and the board ate it. I haven't got the spirit to try to recount the whole thing again -

single stage, hornady lnl, powder dispenser, .44 specials (200 gr Speer GDHP over 9.7 gr of Blue Dot)

First, really love the LNL, makes swapping out dies a breeze - of which I did several times.

My only real gripe was measuring powder. The dispenser isn't terribly consistent, and the Hornady digital electronic scale is a nightmare of inaccuracy and floating values. I watched one load change from 9.5 up to 9.8 and then finally back down to 9.6 while I was just sitting there watching - no ambient air movement, at least none detectable. Had to measure each throw individually on the beam balance - sometimes I got the same amt but just as often I got .2 or .3 grain difference. I am working up this load in .3 grain increments, so this kind of margin of error is enough to knock a round out of one test group and into another. How am I supposed to test accuracy with that kind of variation? Those (with .2 or .3 variation) got thrown back into the hopper. And trying to tap the powder flakes into the .44 special cases was pretty tedious too. If it was a smaller case mouth I know I would have spilled some. I'm not looking forward to loading .38 special because of this.

Anyone have any suggestions? I actually don't mind weighing each charge but would appreciate it if the charge weights were MOSTLY the same, and only had to toss back like one out of ten. I don't know how you can possibly load anything resembling uniform ammo with a powder dispenser (such as on a progressive). If it was only .1 grain we were talking about, ok, but .3 is just way too much, especially if you are working up towards a max load. I dread to think about working with some of the powders that allegedly don't "meter well" like 800x which I had THOUGHT sounded like a very good powder for .40 s&w (now I've got an 8 lb jug of it). Is Blue Dot especially hard to work with? Or something? Maybe I'm just doing it all wrong?

Maybe some of the more experienced folks have a tip or two to relate.

[anyracoon]

Flourescent lights can cause electronic scales to do funny things if they are to close! Other thing is to be sure to let scale warm up and use a surge protector.

[Ugly Dwarf]

Ok, I had a huge post typed in about my experience as a first time handloader, and the board ate it. I haven't got the spirit to try to recount the whole thing again -

Well, I'll let others on the board try to diagnose your issue(s) with powder weight fluctuations, but I figured I'd comiserate on the lost post.

I've had that happen many times after carefully drafting a long email of a touchy nature, trying to get the words "just right" and then everything bombs out... really takes the wind out of your sail when it comes to doing it again.

Regarding the scale fluctuations up and down while watching... did you make sure it is on a level surface? Have you checked the batteries (if not plugged in)? When the electronic scale eventually stopped adjusting, was it at the same weight your balance beam scale said?

I have not had similar experiences with my RCBS 750, but recall reading reviews that said they had that issue when the table wasn't level. I had similar issues with a crappy Frankford Arsenal scale I tried and the problems were resolved with a fresh set of batteries.

As an aside, did you have the same issue using check weights? I wouldn't have suggestions if you did, but I'm interested to know.

[fairfaxjim]

I've also found that moving air (wind, ventilation, heavy breathing) can cause the electronic scales to fluctuate also. They are pretty sensitive - for a reason.

[kurac]

What powder are you using? some of them meter real nice for example W231, Unique is a nice powder but the variation was too much for me so I switched to W231 for most non magnum pistol stuff inlcuding .44 Special.

[Ceemack]

Blue Dot is a flake powder that meters reasonably well--there are no special problems using it, and you should be able to get fairly consistent charge weights if you're using a decent powder measure, and using it correctly. No powder measure is perfectly consistent, but you should be able to achieve something like +/- .1 grain.

You didn't mention which powder measure you're using (some are much better than others, BTW), so it's hard to provide specific advice. But as general rules go, the first thing is to fill up the hopper, then drop three or four charges to get the powder settled down before you do the final adjustment and start charging cases. The second is to be sure and be consistent with how you operate the measure from charge to charge. If it's a rotary measure, remember that the handle should only have two positions--all the freakin' way up and all the freakin' way down. That way you're making sure that the charge cavity gets completely filled and is then completely emptied on each powder charge. Any short strokes will reduce the charge thrown.

For the most consistent weights, you may want to use a powder trickler. This is basically a small cup with a handle and a spout; it dribbles powder out of the spout a kernel or two at a time as you turn the knob. To use it, you set the measure so that it throws a charge that's a few tenths short of what you want, then use the trickler to drop extra kernels into the scale pan until you've got the desired weight.

If you're transferring powder from the scale pan to the cartridge case, you really need to use a powder funnel. That way you won't miss, even with a few kernels.

[Whitesmoke]

If you can get it down to +/-1 or even +/-2 you will be beating most factory match ammo.

Also....do you have a powder baffle in that powder measure? That can often make a +/-3 measure into a +/-1 measure....it worked on my old Lyman 55. and has helped on my other measures too.....

After I get going....and consistant...I only measure every 5th charge or so. Sometimes every 10th.

I don't use an electronic scale....perfectly happy with my old RCBS scale.

[Crazyhorse]

I hit +/- .2 most of the time so I just try to get the measure close to -.2 then just tickle a little more in, also use a funnel!

17.99 heavy, so i like it



3.79

[bruss01]

Thanks for the responses, guys...

Ok, the equipment I am using is the Hornady Lock-N-Load kit, so unless otherwise specified, the equip is Hornady.

The powder measure is the dispenser that comes with the LNL kit. So is the beam balance.

I am going to go back and look at the powder measure... it may not be set up right. Thanks for the info on baffles... I had heard somewhere to fill the hopper half full and try to keep it within half an inch of half full for consistency so I was doing that. My technique is what was demonstrated on the RCBS DVD... all the way up (thwack) and an extra (thwack) then all the way down (thwack) and an extra (thwack). Firmly, with authority but not carelessly or without controlled motion. Just... authoritative. Sometimes it would seem to *hitch* a bit on the way up or the way down. I usually just eneded up dumping those throws back into the hopper. The powder measure was screwed into a LNL bushing and mounted in the press, which is solidly mounted to a 2" thick pine work surface. Pretty rigid, would have to be bolted to concrete to be any more stable. Whenever adjusting the amount, I would always go thru 3 or 4 throws, dumping back into the hopper, before weighing the next.

I've heard good things (did some research) about the LNL measure so maybe it's set up wrong. There are a few small pieces left in the gadget bag, maybe some of them go to the PM? Unfortuantely I don't have the instructions for the kit, apparently they got misplaced somewhere in the setup process. Is there any special adjustment aside from the thumbscrew?

I have noticed that Hornady sells special attachments for this PM - a micrometer adjustment thumbscrew and some other bits... anyone tried these or have a comment?

I need a trickler and a funnel, for sure.

[Ugly Dwarf]

Bruss01,

You can get the instructions for your press at the Hornady site HERE.

If that isn't the right model, check out THIS page.

[BlueOvalBruin]

I have noticed that Hornady sells special attachments for this PM - a micrometer adjustment thumbscrew and some other bits... anyone tried these or have a comment?

I use the Hornady LNL also and I've found that the Hornady Lock-N-Load Powder Measure Handgun Rotor and Metering Assembly is a must for accurate dispensing for handgun loads. It's charge cavity has a much smaller bore so the adjustments are finer.

http://www.midwayusa.com/eproductpage.exe/showproduct?saleitemid=164839

I don't have the micrometer insert for it since I rarely deviate from my .40S&W load (I'm a one handgun man).

Also, make sure the scale is on a flat, solid surface and allow it plenty of time to settle down before you start using it. I don't know if it matters but I like to keep lights away from it too, incandescent bulbs can give off a ton of heat, which might affect the scale.

[Ceemack]

That's a good point...most rotary powder measures actually have two cylinders, one with a large hole for rifle rounds and one with a small hole for handgun rounds. If you're using the large cylinder, it's possible that's the source of some of your inconsistency.

The micrometer screw wouldn't help your particular situation. It's just a way to switch quickly between different powder charges--say, going from .357 Magnum to .223.

[Whitesmoke]

That's a good point...most rotary powder measures actually have two cylinders, one with a large hole for rifle rounds and one with a small hole for handgun rounds. If you're using the large cylinder, it's possible that's the source of some of your inconsistency.

The micrometer screw wouldn't help your particular situation. It's just a way to switch quickly between different powder charges--say, going from .357 Magnum to .223.

I agree....the micrometer won't help you here. But the smaller cyl probably will.

[Ceemack]

One other thing occurs to me. With the exception of Lee, the major reloading equipment manufacturers provide outstanding customer service. If you're really struggling with getting consistent results out of the scale, or if you don't have the small cylinder for the measure, call Lyman.

They'll probably fall all over themselves to help you out.