270 Winchester Reloading Concern

[HumanOperant]

Hi Everyone,

I recently began reloading this past month and have a concern about some brass after resizing. Below is a labeled picture of the problem area that I have noticed on the head of the brass. There is a second picture at a different angle as well. The mark appears and feels (when i scrape my finger nail across it) to be a slight bulge at the head of the casing.

http://i.imgur.com/xevymSZ.jpg

http://i.imgur.com/kfsRYvD.jpg

I doubt that this ring appeared after the factory round was first fired, as it is consistent across the 30 casings that I have resized, regardless of factory ammo brand. I am concerned that I have overlooked some small but critical detail while resizing (too much lube perhaps?) and wanted to get some opinions on how to go about diagnosing this problem.

The Equipment I am using:

Rounds fired from a Remington 700 (270 Win)
Full Length RCBS dies
RCBS IV Single-Stage Press
RCBS case lube and pad
Once Fired (By the Remington 700) Federal and Winchester Brass

Thank you for your input, I really appreciate it.

[Dark Mod]

I get rings like that on pretty much every peice of Large rifle brass i full length resize eventually. Never noticed if they bulged or not, but if its from a bolt gun it probably wont matter.

Are you correctly sizing the entire peice of brass? is the brass going all the way in? the shellholder should just barely contact the bottom of the die at the top of the stroke.

Also, chamber a round once its been resized, if it fits you should be fine. If its a boltgun its probably fireformed to your chamber and wont need to be full length resized anyway so its a non issue.

You may want to neck size this brass, it will last a lot longer and you wont have to trim as much.

Also in the future if you could imbed the photo it would be very helpful, im having massive problems with the format and links for some reason

[CS Sports]

Your chamber is on the large size at the breech end. Not much you can do about it except check your brass for signs of head separation.

[FLIGHT762]

Your chamber may be a little large near the case head. Be sure you're F/L sizing enough. Make sure you set the F/L die to cam over a little. If your brass will chamber in the rifle after repeated firings with F/L sizing you're okay. I've had a few rifles that needed another 1/8-1/12th of a turn of the F/L die into the press to properly bump the shoulder back for easy chambering.

You do need to look for incipient case head separation on repeated fired cases.

I would NOT neck only size for a rifle that will be used primarily for hunting. I will not take neck only sized ammo out into the field for hunting. I learned my lessons many years ago. If you properly set up your F/L die to bump the shoulders of your brass .002"-.003", your brass will last a long time provided you don't don't hot rod your loads.

[HumanOperant]

You may want to neck size this brass, it will last a lot longer and you wont have to trim as much.

Also in the future if you could imbed the photo it would be very helpful, im having massive problems with the format and links for some reason

Duly Noted and thanks for your input. I just placed an order for a neck sizing die, which seems like a great route to go in the future considering that my 270 ammo is only going to be fired out of a bolt-action rifle. Do you feel that these rounds would be safe to fire? I checked some of the the sized brass for Thanks again!

[HumanOperant]

Your chamber may be a little large near the case head. Be sure you're F/L sizing enough. Make sure you set the F/L die to cam over a little. If your brass will chamber in the rifle after repeated firings with F/L sizing you're okay. I've had a few rifles that needed another 1/8-1/12th of a turn of the F/L die into the press to properly bump the shoulder back for easy chambering.

You do need to look for incipient case head separation on repeated fired cases.

I would NOT neck only size for a rifle that will be used primarily for hunting. I will not take neck only sized ammo out into the field for hunting. I learned my lessons many years ago. If you properly set up your F/L die to bump the shoulders of your brass .002"-.003", your brass will last a long time provided you don't don't hot rod your loads.

Great info, especially about using neck sized only ammo for hunting. I appreciate it.

[NorCalNative]

FLIGHT762; "I would NOT neck only size for a rifle that will be used primarily for hunting. I will not take neck only sized ammo out into the field for hunting. I learned my lessons many years ago."

Why is this? What happened?

[RandyD]

I would have a qualified gunsmith examine your barrel and the brass with the protrusion. The protrusion is not normal. You need to determine what is causing it. If a case ruptures during firing it could send hot gas into your eyes and face. You could also cut open a piece of brass down the length of the casing to inspect if the case is beginning to rupture. You could also take a paper clip and make a small L near the end and run it up and down the area of the protrusion to determine and see if the paper clip snags on a protrusion which would indicate that the brass is about to rupture.

[NorCalNative]

OP: I don't mean to thread jack. I'm loading .270 too (building a hunting load), so this is pretty interesting to me.

[HumanOperant]

I would have a qualified gunsmith examine your barrel and the brass with the protrusion. The protrusion is not normal. You need to determine what is causing it. If a case ruptures during firing it could send hot gas into your eyes and face. You could also cut open a piece of brass down the length of the casing to inspect if the case is beginning to rupture. You could also take a paper clip and make a small L near the end and run it up and down the area of the protrusion to determine and see if the paper clip snags on a protrusion which would indicate that the brass is about to rupture.

I am going to cut open one of the pieces of brass right now and take a look. I agree with you completely that I need to isolate the problem. I do not have any brass that has not been resized after firing. I am planning on going to the range on Friday to see how the brass looks after firing, before resizing.

[GeoffLinder]

That is NOT normal and my suspect here is a chamber that is way large at the rear.

One question, are you screwing the size die down till it just contacts the shell plate? If not, try that and see if the bulge get's removed on sizing. If still there, have a Gsmith check the chamber dims.

[Bill Steele]

I have seen this effect. The last time was a guy next to me at the range shooting FGMM 308 out of a BLR (at least I think it was a BLR, a 308 lever gun in any case). The case down by the head was bent out with a noticable crease.

After talking about 308 and helping him spot his shots, he asked if I would like his brass, I thanked him and brought it home. After F/L sizing, it still had the crease. I did the paper clip inspection described above and found no incipit head separation evidence on the inside, so shot them a few more time. The brass was so soft I ended up having to bump the shoulder about every 2nd loading just to get them to chamber and finally got tired of the extra work associated with loading these cases and recycled them.

I generally load my 308 on the warmer side, so I don't think you can expect to get rid of the crease from fire forming. I think it will be there until you get tired of looking at those cases. If it is your gun that creased the case, I would take the advice offered above and have the gun looked at by a competent smith. Maybe bring a case to show him what is happening.

[NoNOS67]

FLIGHT762; "I would NOT neck only size for a rifle that will be used primarily for hunting. I will not take neck only sized ammo out into the field for hunting. I learned my lessons many years ago."

Why is this? What happened?

It's a reliability issue. The last thing you want when hunting, is a round that's difficult to chamber.

[FLIGHT762]

OP: I don't mean to thread jack. I'm loading .270 too (building a hunting load), so this is pretty interesting to me.

It's a reliability issue. The last thing you want when hunting, is a round that's difficult to chamber.

Exactly right. Getting out in the field, in the middle of nowhere and have a neck only sized case fail to chamber and have to hammer on the bolt handle with a piece of wood. Had it happen more than once. No more.

I will neck only size some of my long range 308 win. loads, but these are only shot at a range. I've had to hammer the bolt open a couple of times. I usually only N/O size 3 times and then F/L size, bumping the shoulder back .002". That works well except every once in a while, I get a sticky case.

I have a friend who got a loaded N/O sized case so stuck in the chamber when he was out shooting ground squirrels, the barrel had to be removed by a gun smith, the loaded case had to be drilled out and filled with oil to kill the primer and powder. He said the it cost him a couple of C notes for the job.

ALL of my hunting ammo is F/L sized with the dies bumping the shoulders back .002"-.003" using gauges to measure the bump.

All reloaders should use some kind of case/ shoulder bump gauge to actually measure the amount of shoulder bump resizing their doing with their F/L dies.

It does make a lot of sense not screwing with neck only sizing for 90% of the reloaders out there. The benchrest crowd does use N/O sizing, but that is a very different ball game.

For the O/P, it would be a good idea to use a gauge to see if the F/L sizing is being done properly.

The 270 Winchester was my first, commercial hunting rifle I bought in 1972. I've been reloading for it ever since then and have added 2 more .270's to the collection, recently with a L/H Tikka T-3 .270 Win. that is a pleasure to carry in the field and shoots MOA as advertised. My 270 rifles have taken Deer, Hogs Pronghron and Elk, all with my hand loads.

To the O/P, If you're anywhere near SFO, I'd be happy to help you.

[thomashoward]

Exactly right. Getting out in the field, in the middle of nowhere and have a neck only sized case fail to chamber and have to hammer on the bolt handle with a piece of wood. Had it happen more than once. No more.

I will neck only size some of my long range 308 win. loads, but these are only shot at a range. I've had to hammer the bolt open a couple of times. I usually only N/O size 3 times and then F/L size, bumping the shoulder back .002". That works well except every once in a while, I get a sticky case.

I have a friend who got a loaded N/O sized case so stuck in the chamber when he was out shooting ground squirrels, the barrel had to be removed by a gun smith, the loaded case had to be drilled out and filled with oil to kill the primer and powder. He said the it cost him a couple of C notes for the job.

ALL of my hunting ammo is F/L sized with the dies bumping the shoulders back .002"-.003" using gauges to measure the bump.

All reloaders should use some kind of case/ shoulder bump gauge to actually measure the amount of shoulder bump resizing their doing with their F/L dies.

It does make a lot of sense not screwing with neck only sizing for 90% of the reloaders out there. The benchrest crowd does use N/O sizing, but that is a very different ball game.

For the O/P, it would be a good idea to use a gauge to see if the F/L sizing is being done properly.

The 270 Winchester was my first, commercial hunting rifle I bought in 1972. I've been reloading for it ever since then and have added 2 more .270's to the collection, recently with a L/H Tikka T-3 .270 Win. that is a pleasure to carry in the field and shoots MOA as advertised. My 270 rifles have taken Deer, Hogs Pronghron and Elk, all with my hand loads.

To the O/P, If you're anywhere near SFO, I'd be happy to help you.

You have to check your cases twice. after sizing and after loading
after sizing if the bolt closes hard size a little more. You can see the sizing line going down the neck and after loading to make sure they fit.
all I ever do is neck size.I have it set so the bolt goes down with light pressure. If you have to beat it down you messed up.
The only full length sizing I do is if someone else might have to borrow a few rounds.Sticky cases on opening a bolt is a sign of too much pressure.back off a grain and work back up.