.45 ACP Reload Questions - Seating&Crimp + COL

[ExtremeX]

I am working with some Hornady 230gr FMJ-RM .45 APC (.451) bullets...

First question: What do you guys seat these or similar bullets to, (Cartridge overall length)?
Hornady and Hodgdons say 1.200", but it just LOOKS too deep. Factory ammo is measuring in at around 1.267"... Right now I have my dies adjusted to about 1.250 and they chamber and feed without issues in my 1911.

Second Question:
Dies: RCBS .45 Carbide 3 Die Set (TC)
Do these look OK?

Bullets were seated/crimped, and then pulled for pictures.

#1 and #2 look OK, (#1 has less crimp than #2) but im not sure if that’s normal or I need to expand a little more to stop that from happening. The light colored area right below the ring is where the crimp looks like it start to engage.

Expander is setup with enought bell to just allow it to accept a bullet...

I would prefer to seat and crimp in seperate stations but I am getting setup for a bullet feeding die...

Basically I am looking to you experienced guys to see if my dies are setup correctly.

[XDRoX]

If 1.250" functions in your gun then that's what I would use. Some 1911's are picky and you need to load shorter.

That's too much crimp. Remember, you're not suppose to be doing more than simply removing all the bell. If you can see a ring or mark (which you obviously can) then its too much. It's not dangerous at all, and they'll still shoot, but accuracy may suffer and they just don't need to be crimped that hard.

Especially seeing that they're FMJ. Even with plated, I'm not happy until I see no mark on the bullet when I pull it.

Straight walled pistol cartridges are not like revlolver rounds. A "crimp" is not required. Only the removal of the bell.

[shooterbill]

I load my 45 long. I like a little bit of a line on my bullets. Not heavy, but a light line. It shows me my crimp is working. I find loaded rounds on the ground all the time with the bullets pushed into the case. The angle of the feed ramp pushes the bullets in and the rounds don't function.

[Bill Steele]

I load most of my 200gr-230gr to 1.260-1.265". Likely with RN you will have a wide latitude and still achieve reliable feed.

When seating and crimping in the same die, I would start at just taking the belling out (no denting on the bullet, just no belling left).

If you are loading for a 1911, you may need to crimp down some to obtain the results you desire. I crimp down to .469-.471" at the case mouth for my 1911's, but I use a separate taper crimp die, you still get the dent, but you don't scrape the bullet and get the build up from the single die crimping while the bullet is still moving (like in your picture).

[NiteQwill]

I use a separate die. But that is definitely too much crimp. I only slightly remove the bell from the mouth. When pulling bullets, IMHO, there should be no marks at all.

Remember to drop your rounds into your chamber to see if everything fits, both forwards and backwards.

[bruce381]

If 1.250" functions in your gun then that's what I would use. Some 1911's are picky and you need to load shorter.

That's too much crimp. Remember, you're not suppose to be doing more than simply removing all the bell. If you can see a ring or mark (which you obviously can) then its too much. It's not dangerous at all, and they'll still shoot, but accuracy may suffer and they just don't need to be crimped that hard.

Especially seeing that they're FMJ. Even with plated, I'm not happy until I see no mark on the bullet when I pull it.

Straight walled pistol cartridges are not like revlolver rounds. A "crimp" is not required. Only the removal of the bell.

+1....

[thomashoward]

Taper crimp should not leave marks.
A .45 acp head space is on the mouth of the case, so excessive crimp will alter that

[ExtremeX]

Thanks everyone, ill fine tune the dies tonight. I figure I get this done before the bullet feeding die shows up.

[EWILKE]

I use 1.260 for 230 grain crimp should measure .471 at the top of the brass.

[mjmagee67]

There is a lot of misinformation about "crimp" out there. Every gun is different some will take more of a crimp to feed properly some take less. My old Glock 21 really doesn't really need crimp, but my 1911 with a "match" barrel/chamber needs a crimp or .469, at a crimp of .471 I get FTF's BUT as I said every gun is different. Crimping will not cause accuracy issues, I've done some test on various guns and many gave better accuracy when I crimped, those were rifles, in pistols I could not tell a difference in my 9, 40, of 45.

[bigdrunk92037]

I have a question regarding crimping 45acp. I am setting up my .45 dies on my new progressive. I have read in this thread crimp tight enough to not leave a line on the bullet and crimp tight enough to leave a line on the bullet. Seeing the differing opinions, I am curious about something related.

If I take a crimped round, grab it by the base and tap the nose into my table, how much force should the bullet take before it breaks the crimp and is pushed into the case? Is this a valid test of my crimp die setting or not really?

[ExtremeX]

I test my rounds in a different way to check setback and other crimp related things.

I typically seat and crimp one without powder and primer, and then chamber the round 3-4 times, and take measurements before and after.

In my AR for example after I have chambered the round 3 times, the length would change from 2.2095 to 2.210. .0005” is an acceptable value to me, and the results were consistent across 3 separate tests.

I have not testing my .45 ACP rounds yet, but I will do so in the same way once I get my dies adjusted. Keep in mind setback happens even with factory ammo, its common to see some setback in defense ammo that is constantly being chambered and removed…

[Bill Steele]

I use my thumb.

I call neck tension good on my 45 Auto's if I can't push the bullet into the case with my thumb.

[M27]

for years I have loaded all of my 230 FMJ 1.275 but recently (a few months ago) shortened to 1.270.

as for crimp, you are way over crimping. Crimp just enough to remove the bell maybe 1/8 turn more. That shaving and ring of copper can really harm accuracy.

[ExtremeX]

Thanks for all the help everyone.

I got the seating and crimp die all setup, pulled a couple after and the results look much better.

Worked up some test loads too.

COL 1.255"
Winchester 231
Hornady 230gr FMJ-RN .45 ACP
Charges: 4.5, 4.7, 4.9, 5.0, 5.1 gr loads

I’ll probably test them out this weekend and see how they run.