CTS Case Trimmer Review (In Depth and pic heavy))

[adrenalinejunkie]

Review split up because I can only insert 6 images per post.

I recently purchased a Possum Hollow case trimmer because I was tired of trimming cases with my ball trimmer by hand. It was definitely faster, but there was a degree of inconsistency with the case lengths, and the cases didn't fit snugly in the trimmer. I ran across the CTS trimmer on eBay one day and decided to give it a try. I was especially curious because I previously posted a thread asking if anyone had any experience with it, and couldn't find someone that had.

I contacted Jim the seller and owner, and received a prompt response. Throughout my communication with him, he was extremely courteous and informative, and even offered to tune up my load info and gave me some reloading tips (he's been reloading for a long time and the fact that this trimmer was created by a reloader gives it bonus points in my book). I waited to trim my cases (I had hundreds to trim) until I received my trimmer so I could do a review and comparison to the PH trimmer.

Initial impressions:
I received my trimmer promptly after he shipped it, and my first impressions were great. It seems extremely well designed and robust. The fact that it has 2 large set screws over the one small one on the PH trimmer is also reassuring. The trimmer also comes with detailed instructions, a clear plastic storage case, and an allen wrench for the set screws (really nice touch because I had to dig out a tiny one for the PH).











Trimmer design:
The CTS trimmer seems to be designed similarly to the WFT, except there are no moving parts and ball bearings as with the WFT. I have no experience with the WFT so any comparison is just from what I have heard. There is a large cavity around the cutter for positive shaving ejection, which is a huge plus over the PH and its one small hole next to the cutter. This makes for a much more consistent cut because shavings aren't getting trapped in the trimmer.

[adrenalinejunkie]

The plastic-like insert at the mouth is a blended material and apparently used in the marine and aviation industries. It hugs the case tightly in the trimmer mouth and allows very little play. This is unlike the PH trimmer, in which there is about a millimeter of space around the case.





An advantage that I see with the PH trimmer is that the trimmer can be removed from the power adapter to accommodate a chamfer/debur tool for cases that need that. I like to do mine by hand so I don't overdo it though. The CTS trimmer also makes a much cleaner cut and there is no need for chamferring/deburring as I will explain in a bit.

Set up:
I set mine up with a case trimmed to 1.752 in and tightened the set screws tightly. Set up is easy for both trimmers because it can be done this way. The part that chucks into the drill is much larger and sturdier on the CTS. There is more that goes into the drill as well making it more stable.



Size and weight comparison:
As you can see, the CTS is larger, but it is actually lighter than the PH (because of the aluminum alloy body and composite mouth insert). The CTS weighs in at 3.504 oz while the PH weighs in at 4.780). The 1+oz savings in weight means the drill uses less battery to spin the trimmer, thus extending battery life as well (I heard the drill spinning more slowly with the PH attached).





I used a battery powered drill which got pretty old after a while (especially when the battery started to die so it took longer to trim the cases). I had it plugged into the wall the whole time otherwise it would've died halfway through.

Jim also sells a motor coupler so you can hook the trimmer up to a small motor and change trimmers quickly between calibers. I might end up investing in this even though the drill is MUCH faster than trimming by hand.

Case trimming:

EDIT: *Jim recommends in the instructions that all cases be resized in your own resizing die before being trimmed for the best consistency.

The CTS trimmer spun very smoothly in the drill, and it was immediately obvious when it stopped trimming (indexes off the case shoulder). The tight fit around the case made for an even cut and little vibration. The open area around the case with the PH meant a LOT more vibration in the drill and in the case which got annoying after a short while.

The open ejection area of the CTS made for easy shaving ejection (I HIGHLY recommend using a bucket under the trimmer for any drill trimmer because of the shavings they create). The shavings were mostly held to the walls with centrifugal force and then when the drill stopped they fell into the bucket.

The PH has a smaller ejection hold and it's only on one side, which means more shavings get left in the trimmer. This can mar the case and cause inconsistent trimming IMO.

I noticed larger variation in case lengths with the PH than with the CTS (largest I saw with the CTS was .001 in but it was mostly dead on). I would assume this is because of the 2 larger set screws vs the one smaller one on the PH.

EDIT: Jim says that the small variance in case lengths comes from the inner case mouth not being lubed. This causes the neck to stretch a bit, thus increasing the C.O.A.L. The trimmer still cuts the same every time. To solve this, simply lube the inside of the case mouths.

It also took longer to trim cases with the PH because of the more open design of the mouth and I would assume the cutter design as well. The cutter seems to be designed more intricately on the CTS.



I averaged maximum 3 seconds trim time per case with the CTS with the longer cases but it took mostly around 2 seconds per case. Trim time with the PH was up to 4 seconds most likely because of the vibration.

[adrenalinejunkie]

Chamfer/deburring:
With the CTS, I did not need to chamfer/debur the cases. The cut was extremely smooth and uniform. The PH trimmed cases needed it although the burr on the outside of the mouth wasn't too bad. I tried to get a close up picture of the post-trim case mouths but my camera wouldn't focus.

Jim says that this cut cleanliness and uniformity increases accuracy. I haven't had the chance to get out on the range and test that yet.

Both trimmers can also be used by hand if you don't have a drill or yours runs out of battery, which is a nice touch. It's slower but is still better than a ball trimmer because it takes away the cutting, measuring, cutting, measuring as with the ball trimmer when not used with the case holder.

Case marks:
Both trimmers leave scoring marks on the case body from trimming, but that's honestly not a huge deal for me because these became much less noticeable before when I polished my rounds after trimming with the PH. I would assume the same would apply with the CTS.





Pricing:
The CTS is $42.95 shipped, and the optional motor coupler is $15.10 shipped.

The PH was ~$35 shipped.

Final impressions:
Overall, I think that the CTS is an outstanding trimmer, especially for the money. It does not have a ball bearing system as with the WFT, but IMO this means less chance of trimmer failure. I see this as a great less expensive alternative (almost half the price). I think it's worth the money over the PH due to design, weight, trim consistency, and trim cleanliness.

Jim is an awesome guy to deal with, and answers messages faster than any eBay seller i've previously dealt with. He also has trimmers in other calibers and can make custom ones as well. You can tell that customer service is a huge deal to him (as shown with his 2 week money back or exchange return policy with the shipping on him).

Here is a link to the .223/5.56 case trimmer, and you can find his other ones by clicking view other items on the right hand side.

http://www.ebay.com/itm/CTS-223-5-56x45-Case-trimmer-/280900922606?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item4166ffecee#ht_511wt_1397

Yes it was a long review, but I had a great experience and the trimmer is not well known on this forum, so I thought i'd share.

[OldShooter32]

Well done, thanks!

[adrenalinejunkie]

Well done, thanks!

Thanks! And no problem glad to do it. I think this deserves to have its name out there

[huckberry668]

Trimming off of datum is the best way to go but Giraud is too expensive. PH and WFT make trimming mobile, easy and almost painless. Never heard of CTS but now I know which one I'll buy, thanks!

Have you tried using it to trim by hand instead of drill? I wonder how hard it'd be out in the field with no drill.

[Fyathyrio]

Great writeup, thanks!

You can get a bench top drill press pretty cheaply, that will ease some of your issues with the hand drill. I run my PH trimmer about 500 or 600 RPM and the chips clear nicely, so I imagine they will clear even better from yours.

Do you think the insert composite material will stand up to years of use or do you feel it will wear out after a while?

[Dark Mod]

I literally bought another PH trimmer this morning, too bad you didnt write this earlier, i would have given it a shot.

Seems he only has them for 300 blackout, .223, .308, and 50 bmg.

I have 4 possum Hollow trimmers now, but if i start loading another rifle caliber ill definatley give these a shot.

You did a great write up and it really sold me on the design

[ExtremeX]

[adrenalinejunkie]

Trimming off of datum is the best way to go but Giraud is too expensive. PH and WFT make trimming mobile, easy and almost painless. Never heard of CTS but now I know which one I'll buy, thanks!

Have you tried using it to trim by hand instead of drill? I wonder how hard it'd be out in the field with no drill.

Exactly. I believe that this is a much less expensive and still a great and consistent option. I have tried using it by hand and it's not bad at all. The large trimmer body is easy to grip and easy on the hands. It's a bit more awkward than PH by hand because of the larger part that you chuck into the drill, but that's a compromise for a more stable trimmer in the drill.

Great writeup, thanks!

You can get a bench top drill press pretty cheaply, that will ease some of your issues with the hand drill. I run my PH trimmer about 500 or 600 RPM and the chips clear nicely, so I imagine they will clear even better from yours.

Do you think the insert composite material will stand up to years of use or do you feel it will wear out after a while?

Thanks! I'm definitely going to look into that after I get more money haha. The material seems very solid and well-designed, so I would assume it would. Jim said that it's used in marine and aviation so I would think that this stands up to some pretty tough use.

EDIT: I sent Jim the link to this thread after I was finished and with regard to this he said he has a trimmer with over 30,000 cases spun, and the material has not worn out.

I literally bought another PH trimmer this morning, too bad you didnt write this earlier, i would have given it a shot.

Seems he only has them for 300 blackout, .223, .308, and 50 bmg.

I have 4 possum Hollow trimmers now, but if i start loading another rifle caliber ill definatley give these a shot.

You did a great write up and it really sold me on the design

Ah yeah bad timing but yeah i'd definitely say i've this a shot if you get another trimmer. Thanks for the kind words I appreciate it. Just trying to get a great product out there for a cool guy.

I am still in the learning process so thanks for this review... I need a case trimmer and have a desk top drill press that doesn’t get much use so this seems like a great option.

Since it indexes off the case shoulder, do you resize before trimming?

I don’t know if the RCBS case trimmer would be a better option since it takes into account the overall length of the casing vs indexing off the shoulder. I was thinking of getting the RCBS Trim Pro with the 3-way cutter head. This option would save me some money.

Any input for a greenhorn?

Yeah thanks for reminding me i'll edit the first post to include that all cases should be resized in your own resizing die before trimming. IMO I think that even though this doesn't take into account case OAL, it does the job very well and it MUCH faster than a setup like the RCBS. The RCBS is faster then by hand, but you still have to put each case in the trimmer and with the CTS you just grab a case, put it in the trimmer mouth, then grab the next one. The RCBS is also 3x the price haha.

[Eargasm]

Seems he only has them for 300 blackout, .223, .308, and 50 bmg.

He only has these, but if you send him a case, he'll make you a custom trimmer for the same price ($42) as his others.

I also picked up a CTS earlier this week (I got the motor adapter too). I have two PH trimmers, but both of them had trouble with the allen screw stripping out the threads on the body; the CTS trimmer's screws are beefier and the case is thicker, so there's a much better bite.

[adrenalinejunkie]

He only has these, but if you send him a case, he'll make you a custom trimmer for the same price ($42) as his others.

I also picked up a CTS earlier this week (I got the motor adapter too). I have two PH trimmers, but both of them had trouble with the allen screw stripping out the threads on the body; the CTS trimmer's screws are beefier and the case is thicker, so there's a much better bite.

+1 on everything in this post. The custom trimmer option speaks even more to his service. The set screws are definitely much larger than with the PH, and 2 screws means a more secure hold.

[freonr22]

I found much smoother operation running at 2000-3000 rpm. No chatter and no need to debur . Please some one try the ph at high speed and report findings here. But the cts looks like a superior product to be sure. I have not found a detriment to running high speed in the drill press. Think harbor freight $85 special type..

[ExtremeX]

I just ordered a CTS trimmer for .223/5.56

I have a drill press so hopefully it works out well for me. I might get the .308 trimmer as well but I’m not sure if it’s the ideal for match ammo since it indexes off the shoulder and I only next size, not full length size.

I still like the RCBS Trim Pro and the 3-way head but it does cost a lot more. Hopefully I don’t need to chamfer and deburr like you mention here.

[adrenalinejunkie]

I found much smoother operation running at 2000-3000 rpm. No chatter and no need to debur . Please some one try the ph at high speed and report findings here. But the cts looks like a superior product to be sure. I have not found a detriment to running high speed in the drill press. Think harbor freight $85 special type..

I'm curious as well to see how the PH preforms at high speed, but at the speed that I ran the CTS at, there was a lot of chatter. In for anyone who wants to test that.

Awesome yeah I think you'll definitely be happy with that setup. Not sure about neck-sized cases though. If you send Jim a message i'm sure he'll answer your question. I just loaded up 120 rounds today with some cases I trimmed with the CTS, and there was no bullet-shearing whatsoever, and the outer rim of the mouth is smooth with no burr. I think you'll be good in that department.