Today was a .223 learning day

[Tinknocker]

As a previous post of mine stated I'm new to reloading. I successfully loaded .38 special ammo and decided to try .223 as I was able to pick up some Lyman MSR dies from Ammo Bros. Santa Ana store due to their closing for if I remember correctly 50% off. I have thousands of cases I've saved over the years and did all the prep required checking each case in a case checker before loading. I researched without much luck on the seating depth for the cannelure. I took a chance and watched some You Tube videos and followed their instructions and seated and roll crimp at the same time. After doing around 100 rounds I checked a round in the ammo checker and found they would not go in all the way so I tried one in the chamber of one of my ar15s with the bolt removed and it would not enter either. It seems the case grew at the shoulder where in should be .354 max to .360 plus. I asked the guys at O.C. Reloading in Orange what could be the reason for this? It turns out I should seat the bullet separate from the roll crimp. Does this sound right? Thank for any advice you can give me. Also I found Hornady's sizing lube works better than the Lee's that came in my kit, and it tastes better too!

[Cheep]

Try resizing a few empty pieces of brass and see if they are in specs, if they are and the only area out of specs on the loaded ammo is the neck, use a Lee factory crimp die to reduce the neck diameter. If that is what the problem is, don't roll crimp at all.

[anyracoon]

Lee factory Crimp die is the "Cats Meow"!

[mofo1111]

Do NOT use a "roll crimp"! Use a "taper crimp" on .223. These are meant for a taper crimp. 38 special uses a roll crimp. Putting a taper crimp after seating the bullet will make things easier. You can try and seat the bullet to where the mouth of case sits on in the cannelure. But most will say, just use your reloading book data. Or use what COAL shoots best in your rifle. But now your getting into bullet jump and headspace gap (advanced). I think your issue is trying to use the roll crimp in a cartridge that uses a taper crimp.

[Tinknocker]

The instructions with my dies say to use a roll crimp on bullets with a cannelure and taper crimp on auto loading pistol caliber aka 9mm, 45 etc. I think my problem was the instructions said to turn my seating die with built in roll crimp in farther than I should have and it set back the shoulder and it grew too big to fit in my cartridge checker. I backed if off and slowly turn in down until I got an acceptable crimp, so now they all pass the cartridge checker test

[bigbossman]

The instructions with my dies say to use a roll crimp on bullets with a cannelure and taper crimp on auto loading pistol caliber aka 9mm, 45 etc. I think my problem was the instructions said to turn my seating die with built in roll crimp in farther than I should have and it set back the shoulder and it grew too big to fit in my cartridge checker. I backed if off and slowly turn in down until I got an acceptable crimp, so now they all pass the cartridge checker test

Yeah, sounds like you're on target. If you turn the roll crimp down too far, it will push the neck down and deform the shoulder.

FWIW, I don't crimp my .223 ammo, as the friction fit seems to be fine and I've never had issues with setback.

[tmorse]

I almost always seat bullet and crimp separately. Just seem to get better results that way. Using a progressive press so doesn't require a separate process, only an extra die.

[pacrat]

The instructions with my dies say to use a roll crimp on bullets with a cannelure and taper crimp on auto loading pistol caliber aka 9mm, 45 etc. I think my problem was the instructions said to turn my seating die with built in roll crimp in farther than I should have and it set back the shoulder and it grew too big to fit in my cartridge checker. I backed if off and slowly turn in down until I got an acceptable crimp, so now they all pass the cartridge checker test

Well done. You solved it. In your OP you did not say whether your case prep included trimming to length. Random lengths in mixed lots of brass can cause the same issue on longer cases, if roll crimping.

FWIW. I load for a couple dozen different calibers of all types. I only ever "ROLL CRIMP". On HOT revolver, and tube fed magazine rifles.

[Tinknocker]

Well done. You solved it. In your OP you did not say whether your case prep included trimming to length. Random lengths in mixed lots of brass can cause the same issue on longer cases, if roll crimping.

FWIW. I load for a couple dozen different calibers of all types. I only ever "ROLL CRIMP". On HOT revolver, and tube fed magazine rifles.

Yes I did trimmed all cases as I was finding up to 15/1,000's difference in length from assorted brass, I did not separate by brand as I did for .38 special.

[Tinknocker]

Finally got out to Hodge Rd. last Tuesday and shot the .223 I reloaded and I'm happy to say I didn't blow up my AR or my Mini 14 although the mini flung the cases at least 30' to my 4 o'clock. Now I think I need to consider getting a set of bushings for it.

[gmsoccerfam]

Normal for a Mini-14/Ranch Rifle ejection.
And what everyone else above is true for 223 reloading. I experienced that same shoulder bulge decades ago. Live and learn.
1. Seat and crimp SEPARATELY
2. Size and trim to 1.750
3. Taper crimp with a Lee die if you're using a 2 die set.. Dillon dies came with a separate crimp die in their set, specifically for that reason