Speer manual

[downfall]

I am looking at the Speer info for 45 GAP, 185 Gr FP and it calls for 5.7 Gr 231 Lyman shows a 200 GR JHP using 4.6 Gr 231. I know the bullet nomenclature is different, but that is a huge powder Delta.


I am pretty much a newbie, 8 months behind the press, so I am throwing this out to those with more experience. Does this sound right? Does Speer just test hot loads? this sound like a safe load?

[Clownpuncher]

I am looking at the Speer info for 45 GAP, 185 Gr FP and it calls for 5.7 Gr 231 Lyman shows a 200 GR JHP using 4.6 Gr 231. I know the bullet nomenclature is different, but that is a huge powder Delta.


I am pretty much a newbie, 8 months behind the press, so I am throwing this out to those with more experience. Does this sound right? Does Speer just test hot loads? this sound like a safe load?

Whats the difference in COAL? Between that and the different bullet could be the difference.

[Bill Steele]

As you go up in bullet weight the powder charge goes down. Factor in Lyman being very conservative and you have your delta. 5.7gr for the 185 sounds a little hot, 4.6gr for the 200 sounds like a start load.

[downfall]

Sorry I didn't include the COAL on these loads,
Lyman load used a COAL of 1.080 and the Speer load used a COAL of 1.070

[noylj]

Are you referencing the MAX load or the starting load?
With 231, you can drop the starting load quite a bit, and you are responsible to determine what is MAX in your gun, if you decide to work up such loads.
You need at least one more manual for cross reference. All the manual gives you are the charge weights and what they produced using the components and barrel/action used in the test. They aren't guaranteeing you anything about will work in your gun.
I always check at least three sources (manuals and powder company's loads on the net) and start at the lowest starting load I find.
The GAP would seem to be somewhat of a challenge. It has to be even worse in terms of sensitivity to COL and any bullet set-back and has the pressure to do bad things.
The only manual I have with .45 GAP data is Lyman's cast bullet manual. It references 4.7-5.3 for both of their 200gn bullets, so the data for a 200gn jacketed bullet sounds right on.
The following is my compilation of .40S&W data for 185gn and 200gn jacketed as sort of a comparison:
.40S&W
Bullet Weight Powder Weight Velocity Start/Max PowerFactor COL
HornadyXTP 180 231/HP38 3.7 713 128 1.135
HornadyXTP 180 231/HP38 3.7 706 127 1.135
XTP 180 231/HP38 3.7 696 125 1.135
JHP 180 231/HP38 4.0 790 Start 142
XTP 180 231/HP38 4.1 797 Start 143 1.125
JHP 180 231/HP38 4.5 0
JHP 180 231/HP38 5.0 950 Max 171
XTP 180 231/HP38 5.0 947 Max 170 1.125
JHP 180 231/HP38 5.0 950 171
JHP 180 231/HP38 5.0 940 169 1.120
SpeerPHP 180 231/HP38 5.5 1020 Max 184
SierraJHP 180 231/HP38 5.5 983 Max 177
FMJ 200 231/HP38 4.0 750 Start 150
FMJ, XTP 200 231/HP38 4.2 0
FMJ, JHP 200 231/HP38 4.7 850 Max 170
FMJ 200 231/HP38 4.7 850 170
XTP 200 231/HP38 4.7 857 171 1.125

So, the .40 S&W shows 5.5gn as MAX for 185gn bullets and 4.7 as MAX for 200gn bullets and that is the MAX from all the load manuals maximums I have recorded. Not quite as great as the GAP data, but very close.

[downfall]

I decided to go with my gut feeling and sprinkled in some common sense. I reduced Speers start charge of 5.7 by 10% and will go test those out today. Speer is showing a muzzle velocity of 912 with the start charge of 5.7 with a 185 Gr. FN bullet. Since I am using plated bullets, I figured 10% back should work without damaging the pistol or me.

No surprise here, the reference pistol Speer used was a G37. I will call Speer on this Monday morning and see what they have to say. Thanks for all the help.