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Failure to Feed, AR type rifle

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  • ronas
    Senior Member
    • Mar 2009
    • 758

    Failure to Feed, AR type rifle

    See photos below. They show the 2 marks the bolt makes when the round fails to feed. Each photo shows one of the marks.

    Rifle is Larue OBR 556, bullet is SMK 77g with CCI 450 primer, 24.9 grains of BLC2, with OAL of 2.255 (pretty long), IMI once fired brass, using Magul magazines. The 24.9 is max load according to Hogden online reload data. I can tell you for a fact it's way to conservative. The action would very often fail to lock open after last round with what I previously used, i.e., 24.5 and 24.7 grains. I shot 50 rounds today and always locks open with 24.9 but did have the one jam which is shown in photos.

    No pressure signs and tigther groups with 24.9 grains. I will try 5 rounds maybe tomorrow at 25.1 grains. I might also mention that I had it zeroed with 24.7 grains and when I shot the 24.9 grains POI was 1 1/2 higher, so obviously more velocity which will be good for the range I like to shot at. I was very suprised that a .2 grain increase made such a difference.

    I think I might have done a poor job of loading magazine and that is what caused the jam. Those plastic mags are not rigid like the aluminum ones and you can not just tap mag to move round to rear of mag.

    It might also be the previous round did not have enough power to completely cycle the bolt. I may just be getting to proper load at 25.1 grains of BLC2. I was told by a friend of mine that those loads are usually 10% to 20% low, and that increasing grains slowly to get best accuracy and velocity is not problem, just check each round for signs of excessive pressure. Also my rifle will shoot NATO spec rounds and pressure is greater than the 223 loading data that Hodgen outlines on their online reloading center.

    My reloaded rounds are on the long side and right up against the end of magazine. This may be a problem too.

    Does anyone have any other sugguestion of what might be causing this occasional jam.






  • #2
    rsrocket1
    Veteran Member
    • Feb 2010
    • 2774

    NVM
    Last edited by rsrocket1; 03-16-2011, 8:11 AM. Reason: Op knows what he's doing with loads and others have no problems with overloads so this post was irrelevent

    Comment

    • #3
      OHW
      Member
      • Feb 2009
      • 386

      What are ejector marks? Is it an imprint in the base , similar to a rimfire firing pin mark ?

      Comment

      • #4
        rsrocket1
        Veteran Member
        • Feb 2010
        • 2774

        deleted
        Last edited by rsrocket1; 03-16-2011, 8:09 AM. Reason: see #2

        Comment

        • #5
          ronas
          Senior Member
          • Mar 2009
          • 758

          According to quickload, that load produces 61,300 psi and the .223 is rated at 62,300 max so you are really pushing it.
          I'm shooting with Wydle chamber which can take 5.56 pressures. Are the pressures you quoted above the same for 5.56 chambered rifle?

          Edited:

          I should also mention I don't have any cratered primers or ejector marks.
          Last edited by ronas; 03-14-2011, 7:12 PM.

          Comment

          • #6
            Peter W Bush
            Calguns Supreme Overlord
            CGN Contributor - Lifetime
            • Jan 2009
            • 4727

            Originally posted by ronas
            I'm shooting with Wydle chamber which can take 5.56 pressures. Are the pressures you quoted above the same for 5.56 chambered rifle?
            I don't mean this with any offense or anything negative but I am very curious... Have you read a reloading manual?
            Will trade liquor/wine/beer for parts and accesories and ammo! PM me. Dont drink n shoot. Offer void where prohibited. Must be 21 or older, etc. etc.

            Originally posted by TURBOELKY
            Well, glad you got the kit anyways, I'm sure I'll fondle it a little in the near future..... oh God, that's going to be in somebody's signature....:D
            Originally posted by TURBOELKY
            put me in line, but if Peter W. Bush takes it, I need to be removed from his Signature line.......:D

            Comment

            • #7
              mif_slim
              I need a LIFE!!
              • Apr 2008
              • 10089

              Honestly reload manuals "max" load is what they got for the barrel they tested. Many folks will have different max and those in reloading manual are reference points. I have a friend who loads 1.xgr over max and been doing so for over 10 years. He would get pressure signs at almost 2.0gr so he backs if off. Some long range shooters seats bullet further out to reduce pressure and add a little more powder to equalize pressure but yielding more velocity.

              Anyways, To your question.... Is the round going up the ramp and getting stuck 1/4, 1/2, 3/4 ways or is it going all the way but doesn't fully seat? If it's getting stuck 1/4 or so it might be a mag problem not letting the round go fully and the BCG jams the round causing it to dent...

              That's my guess..
              Last edited by mif_slim; 03-15-2011, 2:17 PM. Reason: Manuel to manual. iphone auto correct.. grr
              Originally posted by Gottmituns
              It's not protecting the rights of the 1%, it's IMPOSING new laws because of the 1%.

              Comment

              • #8
                rsrocket1
                Veteran Member
                • Feb 2010
                • 2774

                NVM
                Last edited by rsrocket1; 03-16-2011, 8:10 AM. Reason: see #2

                Comment

                • #9
                  SixPointEight
                  Veteran Member
                  • May 2009
                  • 3788

                  Ummm, that's not what Mif Slim was suggesting. He was using that as an example to show that all rifles have different maxes. Yours could be 1gr of varget, and mine might not show pressure signs at 57gr. Don't rely on other people's data.

                  Comment

                  • #10
                    ronas
                    Senior Member
                    • Mar 2009
                    • 758

                    If it's getting stuck 1/4 or so it might be a mag problem not letting the round go fully and the BCG jams the round causing it to dent...

                    That's my guess..
                    I believe that's what is happening. The round that jams never makes it to the chamber.

                    I'm going shooting today, I'll take my camera and take photo of jammed round in magazine if it happens again.
                    Last edited by ronas; 03-15-2011, 4:11 AM.

                    Comment

                    • #11
                      SixPointEight
                      Veteran Member
                      • May 2009
                      • 3788

                      What plastic mags? Pmags? I've not heard of many mag issues with them. Those marks on the case have happened to me from not seating my mag fully, the round starts to chamber, then jams, the both lug slips past the rim and digs into the case.

                      Comment

                      • #12
                        uscbigdawg
                        Senior Member
                        • Nov 2007
                        • 1869

                        One of the top rifle shooters at Perry, routinely is grains, plural, over max.

                        Also....Magpuls arent exactly perfect.

                        That said, rule out one thing at a time, including the rifle.

                        Rich
                        "Speed is a tactic!" - R.W.

                        "Pressure is what you feel when you don't know what you're doing." - Chuck Knox

                        "The callus on my finger is from my trigger, not the keyboard!" - Rob Leatham

                        Comment

                        • #13
                          ronas
                          Senior Member
                          • Mar 2009
                          • 758

                          What plastic mags? Pmags?
                          Yes, 20 round Pmags

                          Well I went to range today and the 24.9 load is 31.75 MOA at 800 yards. I'm going to say with this load for now as it is accurate and can get to 800 with decent groups considering bullet weight, lack of velocity and wind. Did not get to shoot at 600 yards but it should be very accurate there. I recall the my groups there were 3" to 7".
                          I did fire off the 25.1 grain loads and cases and primer appeared same as the 24.9 load.

                          Edited:
                          Should mention that bolt locked open each time last round was fired and I had no failure to feed problems. I was very careful how I loaded the magazine.
                          Last edited by ronas; 03-15-2011, 7:37 PM.

                          Comment

                          • #14
                            SixPointEight
                            Veteran Member
                            • May 2009
                            • 3788

                            Ummm...31moa as in..248"??

                            Comment

                            • #15
                              mif_slim
                              I need a LIFE!!
                              • Apr 2008
                              • 10089

                              Originally posted by ronas
                              Well I went to range today and the 24.9 load is 31.75 MOA at 800 yards.
                              You mean 3.9moa?
                              Originally posted by Gottmituns
                              It's not protecting the rights of the 1%, it's IMPOSING new laws because of the 1%.

                              Comment

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