Switching over to copper bullets

[GUNFREAK]

I have been shooting all sorts of lead core full metal jacketed ammo in my bolt gun for years. I am going hunting and will need to switch over to a lead free round. I was told by some friends that I will need to really clean the bore and get all the "bad" copper fouling out of my bore then fire a couple rounds to put back in some "good" fouling before I shoot my lead free bullets. Otherwise my accuracy will be horrible.

For the life of me I cannot wrap my head around this to make any sense. My buddies couldn't explain it either they just did it because that's what they were told.

Is there any truth to this or is this complete B.S.?

BTW, I will be shooting a .30-06 Federal Premium with a Barnes 165-grain bullet.

[Divernhunter]

I load barnes bullets for 30-06 and have great accuracy. This is the low-down. Yes you need to really clean the bore or the copper bullets will foul more. BUT after cleaning it just shoot 1-2 BARNES bullets thru it before going hunting. You may need to rezero the rifle anyway.
Also all you need is 150gr bullets as the barnes bullets act like a lead core bullet 30% heavier. I am even going to 130gr bullets. Be sure to shoot the tipped triple shock bullet they open faster than the non-tipped.

For cleaning the bore you will need a good copper type solvent such as sweets7.62, barnes CR-10 etc. Hoppies #9 will not due it. You need something with ammonia in it. Wipe-out will do much to clean the bore also. Before you start shooting the barnes bullets you need to really claen the bore. Then do not shoot reg bullets unless you clean it before and after, before shooting barnes bullets again.
My info came from barnes bullets both the reloading manual and calling them.

[edwardm]

I can't speak to the technical aspects, but I have found this to be true. After cleaning my rifles that shoot copper alloy bullets (non-lead), I find accuracy as degraded a bit.

At first I thought it was a result of barrel heating, so I cleaned my 700 (30-06), ran 3 fouling shots, and went home. Accuracy on the fouling shots was OK, but not sub-MOA. A week later, without cleaning, I went back to the range and put 6 rounds downrange, at 100 yards. Every single one was in the X, sub-MOA, without trying.

Thinking it was a fluke, I did the same with my LSA in 270 Winchester. Almost the same exact result (more like sub-1/2MOA as the LSA is a better shooter) with fouling, going home, shooting the following week, etc.

Go figger.

I have been shooting all sorts of lead core full metal jacketed ammo in my bolt gun for years. I am going hunting and will need to switch over to a lead free round. I was told by some friends that I will need to really clean the bore and get all the "bad" copper fouling out of my bore then fire a couple rounds to put back in some "good" fouling before I shoot my lead free bullets. Otherwise my accuracy will be horrible.

For the life of me I cannot wrap my head around this to make any sense. My buddies couldn't explain it either they just did it because that's what they were told.

Is there any truth to this or is this complete B.S.?

BTW, I will be shooting a .30-06 Federal Premium with a Barnes 165-grain bullet.

[Fjold]

My 375 H&H doesn't mind switching between Barnes and conventional bullets but my 7 mag does. After shooting conventional bullets I have to clean the 7 mag thoroughly and foul it with a dozen or so shots before it will settle down and shoot the Barnes bullet well again.

[Divernhunter]

I did not mean to clean the rifle and then go hunting. I ment to clean it before shooting the barnes bullets but as always fire 2+ rounds from the clean rifle. Then but it away uncleaned and use it that way for hunting. This is true with any bullet. Often the first or first few(depends on the rifle how many)rounds out of a really clean rifle will shoot slightly or quite a bit to a different point of impact. Then it will settle into shooting constant.

But you really need to really clean it before switching from reg to copper bullets.

[choprzrul]

I have had the best results shooting Hornady's GMXs out of my lightweight .308s. I had used Barnes' original X bullets with superb results out of those rifles, but could not make the TSXs group worth a darn. FWIW, through all of my trials and errors, it seems that all of the lead free bullets like to be pushed hard to group the best. I was actually running out of case room in some instances while seeing group sizes shrink. Just approach max very slowly and carefully while watching for signs of pressure.

Good luck.

.

[Fjold]

I have had the best results shooting Hornady's GMXs out of my lightweight .308s. I had used Barnes' original X bullets with superb results out of those rifles, but could not make the TSXs group worth a darn. FWIW, through all of my trials and errors, it seems that all of the lead free bullets like to be pushed hard to group the best. I was actually running out of case room in some instances while seeing group sizes shrink. Just approach max very slowly and carefully while watching for signs of pressure.

Good luck.

.

Yep, I'm seeing the same thing. The banded Barnes bullets have less bearing surface and seem to have to be pushed near max velocities to get the best groupings.

[GUNFREAK]

Thanks guys, I appreciate the input. I will get a good solvent to get all the old fouling out of the barrel.

[Bill Steele]

Thanks guys, I appreciate the input. I will get a good solvent to get all the old fouling out of the barrel.

I have used Butch's Bore Shine with good results for Copper. The bad news is it is expensive and smells pretty bad (leave the window and door open).

[brianinca]

>>>
But you really need to really clean it before switching from reg to copper bullets.
>>>

Wow, I've not seen that. I clean the same old way I always do, Gunslick foamy cleaner and patches, finish with a patch of CLP. I've got loaded 762x39, 308 Win, 30-06, 270 WSM, 270 Win, 300 WM, 30-30, and 450 Marlin, across 12 rifles in my extended family. OLD rifles and new, if they coppered up before, they still copper up with Barnes. There's nothing magical about their alloy, and there are certainly variations across bullet mfg's that encompass the Barnes alloy differences.

I tested an old 3006 and a new 308 with the foamy cleaners, then ran Sweet's 762 through them. No copper left after the foamy cleaner, why get all wound up about harsh chemicals when cheap foamy cleaner works just as well? Just be sure to use something like CLP to finish, they have water in them.

>>>>
lead free bullets like to be pushed hard to group the best. I was actually running out of case room in some instances while seeing group sizes shrink
>>>

Yes, I didn't get close to published maxes with 762x39, 308 Win and 30-30 Win on my OCW ladder, even using my tumbler to vibrate the charged cases. Got good accuracy results anyway, but all the bigger cases liked hotter loads for the high accuracy nodes. No data from Barnes for 762x39, 270 WSM or 450 Marlin at the time, but their guidelines suggested hot=good for the other calibers.

It's just a bullet, no some weird moly/boron/unobtanium coating. Clean your rifles at the end of the season, practice in the summer with all the inexpensive premium lead bullets you have already loaded and can't hunt with, clean your rifles before the season, foul the barrel while checking your zeros, and hunt!

I've got some Nosler E-Tip's on the shelf to play with, I can't remember if I've bought some GMX yet, but Barnes work OK and they have FAR more bullet selections than anyone else in the lead free market. Be happy!

Regards,
Brian in CA

[uscbigdawg]

I have been shooting all sorts of lead core full metal jacketed ammo in my bolt gun for years. I am going hunting and will need to switch over to a lead free round. I was told by some friends that I will need to really clean the bore and get all the "bad" copper fouling out of my bore then fire a couple rounds to put back in some "good" fouling before I shoot my lead free bullets. Otherwise my accuracy will be horrible.

For the life of me I cannot wrap my head around this to make any sense. My buddies couldn't explain it either they just did it because that's what they were told.

Is there any truth to this or is this complete B.S.?

BTW, I will be shooting a .30-06 Federal Premium with a Barnes 165-grain bullet.

Didn't believe it either, but will tell you I did it on an old 300 WM Model 70 my Dad gave me and it made a difference. FWIW, I think most knew that you meant, clean and then foul with the new bullets. I'm a Barnes guy like others when it comes to taking animals down.

On cleaning the bore, I'll tell you that I swore by Hoppe's and/or Sweet's for years until I tried the products from KG Industries at Freedom Gunworks. On a bet, Bobby had me clean out my 1k-yard rifle after the Allegheny Sniper Challenge and then ran some KG down there and sure enough there was a good amount left behind even after clean patches from the others. No damaging of the barrel either.

I now use KG-1 and distilled water in the ultrasonic for brass cleaning on the 1k rifle as well as the occasional deep pistol cleaning.

Rich

ETA: If you get the KG from Freedom, tell them Rich sent you.