Transporting gun powder

[off grid]

Hello All

I have a question about buying and transporting gun powder.

Can gun powder be purchased out of state and brought back to California or would that be in violation of the law.

Sorry about the rookie question but I overheard a coulpe of folks talking and I would like to know.

Thank you

[Tommy Gun]

Legal to purchase anywhere and driven back. Now quantity could be a question of legality, but I don't think so.

If quantity is the only thing questioning legality, it might have something to deal with your local regulations on Smokeless Powders/Primers storage.

[Divernhunter]

You can also bring into Cali--Primers--Bullets--Brass.
You can take out of Calif the above and powder and ammo.

Almost forgot ---The same is true for shotgun components and black powder stuff.

[JackEllis]

Right now the only restriction is with regard to finished ammunition.

[CCrawford]

There is regulation about how much powder you can have in a private vehicle, both for smokeless and black powder. It used to be in the Wiki off the front page. I don't remember the pounds (found it), but there was some rule about it. Of course, they have to find it and know the laws about it. Last time I came across the NV/CA boarder, the Ag station was not staffed during weekday daytime hours.

11-1.1 In addition to all other applicable requirements of this code, intrastate transportation of small arms ammunition, small arms primers, smokeless propellants, and black powder shall comply with US Department of Transportation Hazardous Materials Regulations, 49 CFR, Parts 100-199

10-3 SMOKELESS PROPELLANTS. 10-3.1 Quantities of smokeless propellants not exceeding 25 LB (11.3kg), in shipping containers approved by the U.S. Department of Transportation, may be transported in a private vehicle.

10-3.2 Quantities of smokeless propellants exceeding 25 lb (11.3kg) but not exceeding 50 lb (22.7 kg), transported in a private vehicle, shall be transported in a portable magazine having wood walls of at least 1-inc. (25.4-mm) nominal thickness.

10-3.3 Transportation of more than 50 lb (22.7 kg) of smokeless propellants in a private vehicle is prohibited.

10-3.4 Commercial shipments of smokeless propellants in quantities not exceeding 100 lb. (45.4kg) are classified for transportation purposes as flammable solids when packaged according to U.S. Department of Transportation Hazardous Materials Regulations. (Title 49, Code of Federal Regulations, Park 173.197a), and shall be transported accordingly.

10-3.5 Commercial shipments of smokeless propellants exceeding 100 lb (45.4 kg) or not packaged in accordance with the regulations cited in 10-3.4 shall be transported according to the U. S. Department of Transportation regulations for Class B propellant explosives.

DOT and Fire NFPA495-85 have regulations covering it. One of many sources.

[Quiet]

Now quantity could be a question of legality, but I don't think so.

If quantity is the only thing questioning legality, it might have something to deal with your local regulations on Smokeless Powders/Primers storage.

Under CA laws, unless you have a valid CA FIRE Explosive Permit, legally, you can only possess 20 lbs or less of smokeless powder and 1 lbs or less of black powder. [HSC 12102]

In order to legally import, transport, or possess more than 20 lbs of smokeless powder or more than 1 lbs of black powder; you will need to have a valid CA FIRE Explosive Permit. [HSC 12101(a)]

Unless you have a valid CA FIRE Explosive Permit, possession or transportation of more than 20 lbs of smokeless powder or more than 1 lbs of black powder is illegal (felony) [HSC 12305] and the powder is subject to immediate confiscation by any CA LEO that discovers it being transported/stored [HSC 12531].




Health & Safety Code 12000
For the purposes of this part, ?explosives? means any substance, or combination of substances, the primary or common purpose of which is detonation or rapid combustion, and which is capable of a relatively instantaneous or rapid release of gas and heat, or any substance, the primary purpose of which, when combined with others, is to form a substance capable of a relatively instantaneous or rapid release of gas and heat. ?Explosives? includes, but is not limited to, any explosives as defined in Section 841 of Title 18 of the United States Code and published pursuant to Section 555.23 of Title 27 of the Code of Federal Regulations, and any of the following:
(a) Dynamite, nitroglycerine, picric acid, lead azide, fulminate of mercury, black powder, smokeless powder, propellant explosives, detonating primers, blasting caps, or commercial boosters.

Health & Safety Code 12101
(a) No person shall do any one of the following without first having made application for and received a permit in accordance with this section:
(1) Manufacture explosives.
(2) Sell, furnish, or give away explosives.
(3) Receive, store, or possess explosives.
(4) Transport explosives.
(5) Use explosives.
(6) Operate a terminal for handling explosives.
(7) Park or leave standing any vehicle carrying explosives, except when parked or left standing in or at a safe stopping place designated as such by the Department of the California Highway Patrol under Division 14 (commencing with Section 31600) of the Vehicle Code.

Health & Safety Code 12102
This chapter does not apply to any possession or use of 20 pounds or less of smokeless powder, or one pound or less of black sporting powder, provided that:
(a) Smokeless powder is intended only for hand loading of small arms ammunition of .75 caliber or less.
(b) Black sporting powder is intended for loading of small arms or small arms ammunition of .75 caliber or less.
(c) All such powder is for private use and not for resale, and, in the case of black sporting powder, there shall be no gift, delivery, or other disposition to another person.
(d) The storage, use and handling of such smokeless and black powder conforms to rules, regulations, or ordinances of authorities having jurisdiction for fire prevention and suppression in the area of such storage, use, and handling of such explosives.

Health & Safety Code 12305
Every person not in the lawful possession of an explosive who knowingly has any explosive in his possession is guilty of a felony.

Health & Safety Code 12531
Any explosives which are illegally manufactured, sold, given away, delivered, stored, used, possessed, or transported shall be subject to immediate seizure by any chief, issuing authority, or peace officer authorized to act under Section 12020. When a permit issued pursuant to this part has expired and is not immediately renewed, any explosives in the possession of the permittee shall be subject to immediate seizure by any chief, issuing authority, or peace officer authorized to act under Section 12020, unless first destroyed by the permittee in accordance with Section 12087.

[fnlrun]

20 lbs I walked out of sportsmans 2 weeks ago with 3 8# and 4 1#.

[ARDude]

20 lbs I walked out of sportsmans 2 weeks ago with 3 8# and 4 1#.

Admitting to a crime!!

[anyracoon]

Don't ask, don't tell?

[kcstott]

20 lbs I walked out of sportsmans 2 weeks ago with 3 8# and 4 1#.

I could not keep up with my competition load outs if I was to stay under these BS regulations

[BAJ475]

Under CA laws, unless you have a valid CA FIRE Explosive Permit, legally, you can only possess 20 lbs or less of smokeless powder and 1 lbs or less of black powder. [HSC 12102]

In order to legally import, transport, or possess more than 20 lbs of smokeless powder or more than 1 lbs of black powder; you will need to have a valid CA FIRE Explosive Permit. [HSC 12101(a)]

Unless you have a valid CA FIRE Explosive Permit, possession or transportation of more than 20 lbs of smokeless powder or more than 1 lbs of black powder is illegal (felony) [HSC 12305] and the powder is subject to immediate confiscation by any CA LEO that discovers it being transported/stored [HSC 12531].

Health & Safety Code 12000
For the purposes of this part, ?explosives? means any substance, or combination of substances, the primary or common purpose of which is detonation or rapid combustion, and which is capable of a relatively instantaneous or rapid release of gas and heat, or any substance, the primary purpose of which, when combined with others, is to form a substance capable of a relatively instantaneous or rapid release of gas and heat. ?Explosives? includes, but is not limited to, any explosives as defined in Section 841 of Title 18 of the United States Code and published pursuant to Section 555.23 of Title 27 of the Code of Federal Regulations, and any of the following:
(a) Dynamite, nitroglycerine, picric acid, lead azide, fulminate of mercury, black powder, smokeless powder, propellant explosives, detonating primers, blasting caps, or commercial boosters.

Health & Safety Code 12101
(a) No person shall do any one of the following without first having made application for and received a permit in accordance with this section:
(1) Manufacture explosives.
(2) Sell, furnish, or give away explosives.
(3) Receive, store, or possess explosives.
(4) Transport explosives.
(5) Use explosives.
(6) Operate a terminal for handling explosives.
(7) Park or leave standing any vehicle carrying explosives, except when parked or left standing in or at a safe stopping place designated as such by the Department of the California Highway Patrol under Division 14 (commencing with Section 31600) of the Vehicle Code.

Health & Safety Code 12102
This chapter does not apply to any possession or use of 20 pounds or less of smokeless powder, or one pound or less of black sporting powder, provided that:
(a) Smokeless powder is intended only for hand loading of small arms ammunition of .75 caliber or less.
(b) Black sporting powder is intended for loading of small arms or small arms ammunition of .75 caliber or less.
(c) All such powder is for private use and not for resale, and, in the case of black sporting powder, there shall be no gift, delivery, or other disposition to another person.
(d) The storage, use and handling of such smokeless and black powder conforms to rules, regulations, or ordinances of authorities having jurisdiction for fire prevention and suppression in the area of such storage, use, and handling of such explosives.

Health & Safety Code 12305
Every person not in the lawful possession of an explosive who knowingly has any explosive in his possession is guilty of a felony.

Health & Safety Code 12531
Any explosives which are illegally manufactured, sold, given away, delivered, stored, used, possessed, or transported shall be subject to immediate seizure by any chief, issuing authority, or peace officer authorized to act under Section 12020. When a permit issued pursuant to this part has expired and is not immediately renewed, any explosives in the possession of the permittee shall be subject to immediate seizure by any chief, issuing authority, or peace officer authorized to act under Section 12020, unless first destroyed by the permittee in accordance with Section 12087.

First, F*** Komifornia. Next, what is the SOL?

[kcstott]

First, F*** Komifornia. Next, what is the SOL?

Powder retailers have no problem delivering 48 pounds of of black or smokeless. Guess how I know??

The solution is keep your mouth shut about what you may or may not have and store it safely away from anything that can cause an issue. My powder is stored in OEM containers in a metal cabinet that is no where near air tight. The cabinet keeps sources of ignition at bay.
Police are not going to pull over a moving van and search every box unless you have something else going on that they are interested in.

I would transport the same way I'd transport a rifle.

[uechikid]

Admitting to a crime!!

He admitted to ?walking out?. He did say how he transported it. 🤷🏻*♂️

[divingin]

Under CA laws, unless you have a valid CA FIRE Explosive Permit, legally, you can only possess 20 lbs or less of smokeless powder and 1 lbs or less of black powder. [HSC 12102]

Always a fountain of knowledge, which is appreciated.

Given that both the CA Dept of Transportation and the Federal DOT would have jurisdiction, have you found anything on federal statutes that would come into play in this scenario? I'd assume there would be something, as the Fed DOT regs are what drives things like the commercial shipper hazmat requirement for primers and powder, and civilian scuba tank pressure test recertifications (hydro test, every 5 years) in order to legally carry them on highways.

Not that I particularly care, just curious.

[mikeyr]

normally I trust "Quiet" completely but I need 3 different kinds of Black Powder and they only sell it in 1lb cans. I was told it was 5lbs of BP by the guys at the local fire department when I asked. They actually asked the fire marshal to get the answer. Now I did go read HSC 12102 and I see 1lb but I am thoroughly confused by the language. I can usually stay under 20lb of smokeless but I shoot a lot of BP in different calibers and have a hard time staying under 5lbs since I need FFg, FFFg and FFFFg powders