Varmint Ammo / Self Defense?

[claxor]

What's the general opinion of using 223 "varmint" ammo for close self defense?

For example: Hornady V-MAX or Federal V Shock

Just interesting in learning, thanks!

[hermosabeach]

It’s all about shot placement.

While a varmint round is not ideal for self defense, it is still better than many Hand gun calibers.

62 grain soft point would be my preferred Self Defense Ammo.


Varmint rounds will shatter near the surface. They might not get deep into vital organs


The 1:14 twist and light bullets in the Vietnam era were not the best stoppers

Military went to heavier bullets and faster twist rates....

[Beelzy]

Be careful with varmint bullets and fast twist barrels, the bullets might blow up before they even get to the target. Yes, that would suck.

[claxor]

Be careful with varmint bullets and fast twist barrels, the bullets might blow up before they even get to the target. Yes, that would suck.

What determines a fast twist barrel? Is 1/8 considered fast?

[WartHog]

What determines a fast twist barrel? Is 1/8 considered fast?

The smaller the second number in the ratio, the faster the bullet spins. A larger second number indicates a slower rate of spin. Yes, a 1:8 twist is considered fast. I have shot hot loads of 40gr V-max out of my 1:9 twist Wyndham Weaponry AR and they did not fly apart. Would not be my choice for a defensive round but if I hit someone in the eye or neck, would not want to be them.

[hermosabeach]

Twist

One complete turn in how many inches

1:7
Bullet makes 1 turn in the travel through 7” or barrel

Light bullets don’t need as fast a twist as a heavy bullet

Modern varmint bullets should be fine in a 1:7 to as slow as 1:14 barrels


—

If the rifle has 1,000 ft pounds of energy- the good news is a varmint bullet will transfer all 1,000 ft pounds into a human.


The green tip Ammo might only transfer part of the energy into the person.
Enter the body at 3,000 FPS and exit at 2,000 FPS. It still has speed and energy and exits.


Ideally a bullet stops in the target and all energy is transferred to the target.

[alpha_romeo_XV]

Check out this video about Winchester PDX1 split core hollow point

https://youtu.be/-XKP6sh59gE

[the86d]

A 40gr .223 V-MAX, in a 1:8 20" barrel, going near-5.56 NATO velocity will put "about a softball size exit wound" in a rooster, if it has a tendency to attack your friend's daughter's face... but they have hollow bones...

[J.R.W.]

the 35 gr ntx makes a permanent soda can size wound cavity in coyotes & other such varmit critters at 15 yrds or less & seem to always open .it is almost instantly lethal.i use them for varmits yes they also in a HD rifle at home .i have used them out to 250 .in 22-250 .less trama at that distance but still do a good job for what i need .

[The War Wagon]

ANY bullet, beats using your rifle as a club.

THAT said, I prefer 69gr & 75gr JHPs as my HD rounds... but M193 and even M855, beats the "club" action!

[rkal49]

Can someone help me with the reloading process of 45-70govt? I have just started for the first time by purchasing the Lee reloader kit, IMR4895, Shells from range day, mallet, and Hornady spray case lube, as well as case shell chamfer tool. Im still looking for 300gr cast bullets as well as primers

Do ya'll recommend I purchase anything else that will assist me with the reload process of 45-70?
I am located in sacramento so let me know if anyone has any large rifle primers as well as 45-70 cast bullets. Would be cool if I can meet some of you reloaders and watch y'all work your magic so i can learn a thing or two.

[Cowboy T]

Can someone help me with the reloading process of 45-70govt? I have just started for the first time by purchasing the Lee reloader kit, IMR4895, Shells from range day, mallet, and Hornady spray case lube, as well as case shell chamfer tool. Im still looking for 300gr cast bullets as well as primers

Do ya'll recommend I purchase anything else that will assist me with the reload process of 45-70?
I am located in sacramento so let me know if anyone has any large rifle primers as well as 45-70 cast bullets. Would be cool if I can meet some of you reloaders and watch y'all work your magic so i can learn a thing or two.

This really ought to be in a separate thread...but with that said, .45-70 Gov't would certainly work well against an assailant!

I would also recommend getting a tumbler and a cleaning medium (crushed walnut or crushed corn cob) to clean your brass after firing...though simply wiping it clean will work. Oh, and dies...you'll need a set of .45-70 dies.

[JackEllis]

What's the general opinion of using 223 "varmint" ammo for close self defense?

For example: Hornady V-MAX or Federal V Shock

Just interesting in learning, thanks!

Since this is a purely academic discussion and I'm about as far from an expert as you can get this post is worth about what you paid for it.

My brother the cop explained he was taught to shoot at the center of mass in order to stop someone if it ever became necessary. Not kill. Stop. If you're in a home defense situation it generally means you're shooting at someone you could hit with a pistol assuming you're a halfway competent shooter, which for all practical purposes means no more than ten yards. For a rifle, that might as well be point blank range. You need to think in terms of stopping the threat, which is not the same as killing someone.

Even if it's frangible, the only thing that's gong to stop a rifle round at near point blank range is a fairly thick hardened steel target. Not that it's necessarily scientific or conclusive but in this test