My journey to reloading excellence.

[five.five-six]

With a pistol, at any significant range, you are the largest variable. Your sight alignment, trigger control, and follow through will cause much more error than normal ammunition variation (barring any large obvious inconsistencies.)

Funny how you [snip] out the part where I lead with “I’m not perfect” and then to go on and state that I’m not perfect. OK

I’m well aware of that, I’m trying to eliminate the misses that aren’t caused by me.

I haven't crunched the numbers, I don’t really know how to. That’s probably a good point of research for me but considering that terminal velocity accelerates about the same from one chunk of lead as the next, common sense says that a .45ACP is going to drop the same in the time it takes to go 125 yards as a 6BR will drop in the time it takes to go 500 yards or thereabouts.


I finally bought a range membership being as it’s walking distance from my house. It’s a bit frustrating because since covid they open at 10 and close at 5 so I try to swing by on my lunch hour because I refuse to go on the weekends

Anyway, they are closed for several days due to range maintenance so, no data this week, I’m working from 6 to late all the rest of the week Probably next week too.

[Dirtlaw]

If you are looking for precision rifle loads, IMHO you should start with a more precise method for determining OAL : https://www.sinclairintl.com/reloadi...prod35491.aspx

Read the links I posted here: https://www.calguns.net/calgunforum/...2&postcount=31

.

Changing gears ... do you have any thoughts on OAL with respect to handgun bullets? I understand it's a different beast, but ...

[Dirtlaw]

Thank you OP for starting the post. It's a great discussion!

[five.five-six]

Thank you OP for starting the post. It's a great discussion!

[ghilligan]

Have you calibrated your chronograph? Is there a published tolerance for accuracy + or - X fps?

I am not sure of a way to calibrate my MagnetoSpeed.
MagnetoSpeed claims an accuracy "between 99.5% and 99.9%". I'm not sure exactly what that means.

Independent tests I've seen online seem to agree that the MagnetoSpeed is accurate and consistent. I've also noted that when I plug my load data and mv into a ballistic calculator, the bullet drop results are within a few inches, even at 1000 yards, so the mv values I'm recording must be pretty accurate.

For handguns, I've borrowed a Competition Electronics chronograph at the range, set at 10 or 12 feet away. I have no idea how it is calibrated.

[five.five-six]

Have you calibrated your chronograph? Is there a published tolerance for accuracy + or - X fps? What's the difference in how well each batch shoots, because at the end of the day, that's what really counts, isn't it?

[edgerly779]

That bench array is to pretty to use. All it needs is a bright yellow ribbon (LOL) I have presses mounted on a 2"x 10'" for clamping to a bench out in v]campgrounds or our hunting sites. Then couple on bench. Nothing better than to go to Lake Cachuma put boat in fish in am and mid day process brass. Lots libtards up there. I do the same thing at Big Bear less idjits there for me.

[divingin]

I'd take your comment a bit further and observe that in general the degree of acceptable consistency (group size) depends on the application. For thousand yard benchrest competitions, minimizing ammunition variation is critical whereas when you're after venison, one inch groups at 100 yards are probably adequate for most of us.

I believe my comment was clarified as relating to pistol.

Rifle is a whole different animal. It is much more common to use support with a rifle, making it possible (and much more common) to shoot much closer to the system (ammo + firearm + shooter) potential with a rifle than a pistol.

[JackEllis]

It WAS your turn to ask a good question

I won't claim I did exhaustive research but a couple of things popped out when I spent all of ten minutes digging around.

1) Whichever chronograph one chooses to use, it has to be set up correctly. I have a Caldwell and although I should have known this, it has to be aligned correctly if you want to compare speeds from one session to the next (for example, to determine temperature sensitivity. If it's out of horizontal or azumith alignment by one degree, the impact is equal to almost two percent of what you're measuring. For a typical rifle, that one degree alignment error equates to about 50 FPS.

2) I've read several accounts where Labradars are finnicky about how they're positioned. If you don't position them correctly or you add a suppressor, it may take a few extra shots to get them sensing.

3) Apparently there is no way to calibrate most consumer grade chronographs.

4) One clear weakness of the optical units is the short length of the sensor box. Increasing the distance between the sensors so the unit is less sensitive to alignment errors biases the measured velocity downward because the bullet has a longer distance over which to slow down, but the tradeoff might be acceptable.

Also I misspoke earlier when I suggested calibration errors might be influencing ghilligan's results. Instead it might be that the chronograph he's using isn't precise enough to pick up smaller differences in MV, or it might be that small variations in the relative positions of the gun and the sensor are responsible.

I need to read this article about three different types of chronographs more carefully.

[LynnJr]

Snipering (yes I said that) and bench rest shooting are very different things. They both use a gun but after that the similarities taper off dramatically.

As for sniper’s hide, I’ve been stopping by that place for about 15 years and I still don’t know what it’s all about. I do know that they have a lot of interest in my old .308 brass and don’t seem to care much at all that it’s been sorted by headstamp.

I’ve come to the conclusion that it’s not impossible but more trouble than it’s worth to load .308 for past 300M with out at the very least having matching headstamp.

If your after top accuracy you weigh your brass so it's all within 1 grain after all prep work has been done.
You weigh your powder charge to the single kernel of powder and you seat your bullets with a comparator to 0.001 variation.
None of that is difficult and your target will show you it works.
After that there are many minor steps you can take to remove fliers.
I hunt deer with Benchrest rifles so I don't listen to most of the nonsense on the internet and I use my real name.

As to chronographs you need to know the accuracy of the unit.
If your shooting at 3000 fps and your chronograph is good to 0.01 percent it will be off by 30 fps which does you no good at all.

[five.five-six]

As to chronographs you need to know the accuracy of the unit.
If your shooting at 3000 fps and your chronograph is good to 0.01 percent it will be off by 30 fps which does you no good at all.

I think your math is off.

10% would be 300FPS
1% would be 30FPS
0.1% would be 3FPS ( that's what my labradar is rated at)
0.01% would be 4IPS, which I think would be phenomenal


I think I should just buy a new gun. Presently I am working up a load for a 24" BBL AR15. the Hornady #2278 I am staring off with touch the lands at 2.350 and my magazines won't accept 55 grain rounds much longer than 2.260.

I think I'm just going to run through the load development drill on this upper and single load rounds while I keep my eyes open for a bolt gun.

0.010 jump is a good place to start?

[OpenSightsOnly]

I think your math is off.

10% would be 300FPS
1% would be 30FPS
0.1% would be 3FPS ( that's what my labradar is rated at)
0.01% would be 4IPS, which I think would be phenomenal


I think I should just buy a new gun. Presently I am working up a load for a 24" BBL AR15. the Hornady #2278 I am staring off with touch the lands at 2.350 and my magazines won't accept 55 grain rounds much longer than 2.260.

I think I'm just going to run through the load development drill on this upper and single load rounds while I keep my eyes open for a bolt gun.

0.010 jump is a good place to start?

Hornady's 68 grain match bullet is designed for 2.25" or 2.26" magazine length ammo since this is designed for service rifle competition, just like the 77 grain bullet.

What powder are you using? What kind of barrel and chamber you have?

Your barrel will determine if it likes your bullets and powders.

[five.five-six]

Hornady's 68 grain match bullet is designed for 2.25" or 2.26" magazine length ammo since this is designed for service rifle competition, just like the 77 grain bullet.

What powder are you using? What kind of barrel and chamber you have?

Your barrel will determine if it likes your bullets and powders.

Right now I'm using varget


2.340 drops right in, It's a DPMS upper stamped .223 1-9

it's target crown barrel .920 at the muzzle

[OpenSightsOnly]

Right now I'm using varget


2.340 drops right in, It's a DPMS upper stamped .223 1-9

it's target crown barrel .920 at the muzzle

Varget is good, use 2.25" with the 68 grain bullet and 24.5 grains of Varget.

Have tested that load with my WOA A2 upper and this load is also found in Hornady's reloading manual.

Have also used 23.8 grains of 8208XBR or H4895 with Hornady's 68 grainer or 69 SMK, all magazine length. Dont bother jumping the 68s.

You want to play around with bullet jumping, change your barrel's twist and use the long 80 grain bullets.

[five.five-six]

Varget is good, use 2.25" with the 68 grain bullet and 24.5 grains of Varget.

Have tested that load with my WOA A2 upper and this load is also found in Hornady's reloading manual.

Have also used 23.8 grains of 8208XBR or H4895 with Hornady's 68 grainer or 69 SMK, all magazine length. Dont bother jumping the 68s.

You want to play around with bullet jumping, change your barrel's twist and use the long 80 grain bullets.

Why no jump 68's?


Today I fireformed a few of my new new Norma .223 brass and ran a ladder on .45ACP in the new starline brass. It completely missed 3 strings. I'm about 90% sure its user error but I'll figure it out.

I happened upon a Dillon beam scale. I'm going to start using it a bit and see if it helps with SD and SE. I'm on the lookout for a storage case for it