New to rifle loading

[steelholder]

Actually, you're using a different projectile (from the same box).

Shouldn't the die seat the projectile the same distance though? It's not unscrewing or screwing in at all between loads.

[kevins750]

Shouldn't the die seat the projectile the same distance though? It's not unscrewing or screwing in at all between loads.

The seating stem grabs the bullet at a pre determined diameter. So as was said earlier not all bullets are exactly the same diameter in the same spots. Even when the bullets are in the same box, they are/can be thousandths of an inch differences.

When you use a comparater it grabs the bullet at the ogive( kinda where the "cone" of the bullet is) and we measure from there for our distance to the lands of the rifling.

Bullets aren't all identical there are variances, we sort them out. But that is another story for another time.

Just shoot them the way they are.

[M1NM]

Just starting - I assume once fired brass - lube cases - deprime and resize on the up stroke - reprime on the down stroke. toss in pile - fill with powder seat bullet - fire and repeat 3-4 more time before you'll need to trim. Don't over think it. I've been reloading since 1968 and only bought a tumbler a couple years ago just because someone gave me a bunch of ugly 5.56 brass.

[five.five-six]

Thanks for all the replies guys, I am loading for precision only. Keep the responses coming please..

[steelholder]

Hey all I've been fine tuning my loads and my groups have been getting smaller and smaller and today I hit my smallest 3 shot group yet, I know this is probably an everyday thing for the more experienced precision shooter but for a factory rifle I think its shooting great. I was able to get other similar groups around .4" with this same load. The accuracy was seen as far as 600 yards. super excited!

[ghilligan]

Cartridge & bullet seating length

Nice group!

I'm new to reloading as well, and that's a better group than I can achieve with my handloads so far.

You mentioned that you were getting inconsistent COAL numbers while seating bullets. I'm getting the same kind of inconsistencies, and it's really frustrating.

I've noticed that the Sierra 175g Match Kings have an ogive-to-base length that varies about +/- .0025", so I would expect my COAL (or, more accurately, my ogive-to-cartridge-base) measurements to vary by .005" But sometimes, the variation of my loaded rounds is even bigger.
(For comparison, the Honady 178g ELD-Xs I've measured are +/- .0015" and the 178g ELD-Ms are +/- .0000").

I can tailor each round individually, seating every bullet a bit too long, and then dialing down my micrometer seating die a few thou at a time, double-checking each round with the Hornady comparator, and re-seating until I get the desired length. But this is a huge PITA.

I've also tried just leaving the seating die set, and letting my cartridge lengths vary by several thousandths.

Neither approach seems to yield better results.

I've been recording the cartridge lengths and and muzzle velocity of each round I've loaded, and honestly, I can't find any correlation between a few thousandths of length and velocity (or group size). I'm wondering if you've found the same thing.

[ar15barrels]

I'm new to reloading as well, and that's a better group than I can achieve with my handloads so far.

You mentioned that you were getting inconsistent COAL numbers while seating bullets. I'm getting the same kind of inconsistencies, and it's really frustrating.

I've noticed that the Sierra 175g Match Kings have an ogive-to-base length that varies about +/- .0025", so I would expect my COAL (or, more accurately, my ogive-to-cartridge-base) measurements to vary by .005" But sometimes, the variation of my loaded rounds is even bigger.
(For comparison, the Honady 178g ELD-Xs I've measured are +/- .0015" and the 178g ELD-Ms are +/- .0000").

I can tailor each round individually, seating every bullet a bit too long, and then dialing down my micrometer seating die a few thou at a time, double-checking each round with the Hornady comparator, and re-seating until I get the desired length. But this is a huge PITA.

I've also tried just leaving the seating die set, and letting my cartridge lengths vary by several thousandths.

Neither approach seems to yield better results.

I've been recording the cartridge lengths and and muzzle velocity of each round I've loaded, and honestly, I can't find any correlation between a few thousandths of length and velocity (or group size). I'm wondering if you've found the same thing.

Don't try to match up the OAL's of individual loaded rounds.
It will be less accurate than if you leave the seating adjustment the same and let the OAL's vary.
This variance is in the TIP of the bullet's length, not in the Ogive.
What matters is the consistency of the ogive to throat when the rounds are in the chamber.

You are not seeing differences because either your rifle is not accurate enough to show them (you are looking for variance within the noise) or because you are not a good enough shooter to generate the groups that would be able to see the variances (again looking for variances within the noise).

Go lookup signal-to-noise-ratio if you didn't already know what I mean by noise.

[ghilligan]

"noise" in collected data

Don't try to match up the OAL's of individual loaded rounds.
...

What matters is the consistency of the ogive to throat when the rounds are in the chamber.

Yes, this is what I mean; I am measuring/recording the ogive-to-base measurement only.

I've tried both seating all bullets to maintain the same ogive-to-lands distance in the rifle (by fiddling with the seater for each round to get the finished measurement just right), or leaving the seating die alone, and letting the ogive-to-lands distance vary by .005" or so.

From my muzzle velocity numbers, there's no evidence that either method produces more consistent results (low ES and SD numbers, or group sizes), from my rifle.

I'm wondering if the OP has seen the same thing, since he mentioned similar frustration with bullet seating.

You are not seeing differences because either your rifle is not accurate enough to show them (you are looking for variance within the noise) or because you are not a good enough shooter to generate the groups that would be able to see the variances (again looking for variances within the noise).

To eliminate (or reduce) the interference of my marksmanship skills, I started out just recording muzzle velocity and not worrying about group sizes.

I realize that I've still got a lot to learn with my marksmanship and reloading practices, so I appreciate the input I'm getting on CalGuns.

By "noise", I assume you're talking about other reloading variables that I'm not controlling well, like neck tension, case volume, and possibly my crappy stock Savage 10 chamber?