Shotgun Shells - reloadable?

[sigguy552]

I recently picked up skeet/trap shooting again and shoot primarily at richmond which requires biodegradable wads/steel shot. The biodegradable wad shells they use are kent brand and I was wondering if they can be reloaded?

General question, how can you determine if a shotgun shell can be reloaded?

[beetle]

In general most shotgun hulls can physically be reloaded. What I mean is that there is nothing physically stopping someone from reloading the hull. The real question is -- does load data exist for that hull?

unlike metallic reloading, shotgun reloading requires following specific recipes. Even if you use the exact same components (powder, wad, shot), two different hulls can give vastly different pressure results. So if you have a recipe that is mid-high range on one hull, it could be over pressure with a different hull.

That being said the Kent hulls I've seen are cheddite hulls. There is a reasonable amount of load data for cheddite hulls.

European hulls (like Cheddite, Rio, Fiocchi, etc) require different wads then American hulls (Remington, Winchester) so most reloaders don't bother picking up the european hulls. therefore the european hulls are pretty easy to find on the range. I reload them and they make a very nice shell. Since the supply is so plentiful I usually only reload them once or twice and toss.

[PoorRichRichard]

Beetle, would you mind PMing me some load data for Kent/Cheddite hulls?

[sigguy552]

Beetle, can you post it publicly so we can all see it? Also, how does one identify for certain if they are cheddite hulls?

[beetle]

the powder sites all have cheddite data

http://www.hodgdonreloading.com/

http://www.alliantpowder.com/reloaders/index.aspx

to determine if they are cheddite, take a flashlight and look at the basewad. is it white plastic? also does hull itself has small ribs on the plastic? finally see if there are stars on the bottom of the "brass" (actually it's brass washed steel). If the answer to all of the above is yes then it's likely to be cheddite.

[beetle]

also, I didn't consider the whole biodegradable / steel angle. If you are trying to reload the hull and make biodegradable / steel, then my advice is to forget it.

The only biodegradable wads that are readily available is for american tapered hulls with lead shot. I think you will have a hard time finding biodegradable wads for steel shot and European straight walled hulls.

[edgerly779]

I have no idea where to get tapered biodegradable wads. In olden days we reloaded federal paper low base with ljutic mono wads and used red dot and reclaimed shot which was 6 bucks a 25 pound bag. With no labor cost it was about $1.25 per box. As a teenager in AZ we would hunt in morning and I would use an old lyman 2 stage press to reload for that evening and next morning. I don't know how many rounds I loaded in those years. It was a lot.This started in 1966 and back then we shot at aqua sierra in chatsworth it was owned by Roy Rogers.

[beetle]

I have no idea where to get tapered biodegradable wads. In olden days we reloaded federal paper low base with ljutic mono wads and used red dot and reclaimed shot which was 6 bucks a 25 pound bag. With no labor cost it was about $1.25 per box. As a teenager in AZ we would hunt in morning and I would use an old lyman 2 stage press to reload for that evening and next morning. I don't know how many rounds I loaded in those years. It was a lot.This started in 1966 and back then we shot at aqua sierra in chatsworth it was owned by Roy Rogers.

unfortunately the cost of lead has skyrocketed. reclaimed is in the $25-$28 range while new is in the $33-$40 range. you are not going to save a lot of money by reloading, maybe $0.50 a box. I do it simply because I enjoy reloading - I do it more as a hobby not really for cost savings.

Biodegradable wads are made by downrange -- they have several different styles to choose from: http://www.downrangemfg.com/index.ph...gory&Itemid=51

[sigguy552]

also, I didn't consider the whole biodegradable / steel angle. If you are trying to reload the hull and make biodegradable / steel, then my advice is to forget it.

The only biodegradable wads that are readily available is for american tapered hulls with lead shot. I think you will have a hard time finding biodegradable wads for steel shot and European straight walled hulls.

Thanks for the insight/advice. It makes sense now why the bunch of old hoarders at the trap/skeet club weren't scavenging the shells!

For the record, I believe the Kent hulls are indeed cheddite.

Do you have a recommendation for the most economical hulls that can be loaded for biodegradable/steel rounds?

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[JagerDog]

Thanks for the insight/advice. It makes sense now why the bunch of old hoarders at the trap/skeet club weren't scavenging the shells!

For the record, I believe the Kent hulls are indeed cheddite.

Do you have a recommendation for the most economical hulls that can be loaded for biodegradable/steel rounds?

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The best "cheap" hull for reloading is the Remington "Gun Club". It loads like most all Remingtons (STS/Nitro/Gun Club). Has a steel base. Is of tapered/integral basewad construction. TMK no factory steel shell has this configuration.

I've talked to the rangemaster at Richmond and a lot of guys are reloading steel with the Downrange oxo-bio wads, though they are designed for lead/soft shot. Wads made for steel have slit petals rather than molded petals, to better protect the shotgun bore. To me that risks the shotgun bore, but to each his own risk/reward.

[beetle]

I think JagerDog is on the right track. The limiting factor will be bio-degradable wads. There really isn't much choice here -- so you'll be "stuck" using the oxo-bio wads from Downrange. Since they only make these for tapered hulls, you have to use either Remington or Winchester. The most economical of these two would be Remington Gun Clubs (for example, $49.99/flat at Cabelas during Black Friday).

Most steel wads are designed differently so that the shot is fully encased in the wad.

Steel wad:


Lead wad (this is one of the choices of the OXO-Bio):


Notice how the steel wad is not as "open" and fully encases the lead shot? this is done to protect the barrel.

On the other hand, lead shot wads have gaps between the petals, and in most cases the shot overflows the top of the wad slightly.

Depending on the cost/value of your shotgun it might not be worth it to try and reload steel shot in biodegradable wads designed for lead because of potential barrel damage. If I really wanted to try, I would probably get the 1 1/8 oz wad, and load 1oz of shot (to keep the shot inside of the wad) and use an overshot card on top of the lead for good crimps. I have no idea if this works, I'm just guessing at this point.

good luck!

[Kingair001]

Why not use 1 oz wads if you use 1 oz of shot ?

[sigguy552]

This reloading for biodegradable/steel sounds like a boondoggle. I'm going to chat up the old dudes at the range and see if they can share any of their insight. Otherwise, I'm just going to buy 10cases and call it a day.

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[McGuiver]

I think JagerDog is on the right track. The limiting factor will be bio-degradable wads. There really isn't much choice here -- so you'll be "stuck" using the oxo-bio wads from Downrange. Since they only make these for tapered hulls, you have to use either Remington or Winchester. The most economical of these two would be Remington Gun Clubs (for example, $49.99/flat at Cabelas during Black Friday).

Most steel wads are designed differently so that the shot is fully encased in the wad.

Steel wad:


Lead wad (this is one of the choices of the OXO-Bio):


Notice how the steel wad is not as "open" and fully encases the lead shot? this is done to protect the barrel.

On the other hand, lead shot wads have gaps between the petals, and in most cases the shot overflows the top of the wad slightly.

Depending on the cost/value of your shotgun it might not be worth it to try and reload steel shot in biodegradable wads designed for lead because of potential barrel damage. If I really wanted to try, I would probably get the 1 1/8 oz wad, and load 1oz of shot (to keep the shot inside of the wad) and use an overshot card on top of the lead for good crimps. I have no idea if this works, I'm just guessing at this point.

good luck!

You could try these sleeves with bio wads and steel shot.

http://www.ballisticproducts.com/Thin-Mylar-protective-shotshell-wraps-003/productinfo/MYTHIN/

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[Thefeeder]

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I'll share what I know about loading steel, wads and Kent Steel w/ degradable wads

All the steel shot wads I have for reloading have slits. All the factory steel shells I have shot, have slits....this is to shed the wad as in lead shells.

There are un-slited wad made, and the ones Bettle mentioned may be one of those....they are made so the reloader can add slits (2-4) to customize a load.

Slits are closed shut when in the shell and open after leaving the barrel.

The bio-wads that are used @ Richmond, IIRC, they sell them there also, can be used safely for steel as Kent is using the same slit, thin wall wads. Open up a Kent w/ bio wad shell and the wad looks like a lead wad would...slit and just as thick

Barrel damage....? small shot and thin wads looks to be fine for Kent. But all the steel wads I have seen and used are very thick.

I say ....reload...it will be the same type of wad Kent is using....but I would caution about using shot larger then what you can buy from Kent using the bio wad #7 may be the safe max.

Added ...when reloading steel make sure the shot is fully seated in the wad...the shot column should never be higher then the wad is tall