Range Report cont.

[kevins750]

I have had some luck with the Sierra 63 gr iirc and h4198 and imr 4320. I use varget with 77gr noslers.

[RiskyBusiness]

Sierra 69, 24-25 grains of varget, 2.260" OAL, CCI 400, military case trim to minimum, do not apply crimp when seating bullet.

If your rifle doesn't shoot that load something is wrong with it or you need more practice.

Gonna make 5 of those tonight and report back tomorrow thanks! By the way can i ask why no crimp or are you saying just during the seating? because i have a LFC die and the seater does not crimp in the same action.

[RiskyBusiness]

This group was my wife shooting her $340 PSA upper 223 wylde 1-7 twist with 1-4 power bushnell. 15 rounds in a 20 round mag all in succession no cool down at 100 yards. Load as above. Pretty typical results for just about any AR and a decent shooter.

Little bit or horizontal stringing but not super concerned. The hand guard is almost touching the barrel at rest.

Sounds like my build, i have a PSA $80 barrel 1:7 and 1-4x bushnell lol
will do the above mentioned, thanks.

all in succession? so shoot the batch of 5 without taking my eyes off the scope?

[FLIGHT762]

i honestly couldn't see it as my crosshairs covered what was the black dot in my sight.

^^^^^^This is part of your problem ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^. Use a contrasting target color, grey, white center, blue etc. Use a target where you can see your crosshair and slice the pie.

Try that before changing all of your load data. I used 55 FMJ's for decades W/ 26.0 of H-335 that gave acceptable accuracy. You're asking too much out of the 55 M-193 FMJ.

[kcheung2]

Is that PSA barrel the nitrided one?

[17+1]

Gonna make 5 of those tonight and report back tomorrow thanks! By the way can i ask why no crimp or are you saying just during the seating? because i have a LFC die and the seater does not crimp in the same action.

Don't apply crimp to case during bullet seating. The 69 sierra doesn't have cannelure anyways. If you have a wylde chamber the bullet should be fairly close to the lands at 2.260" OAL. Trickle up the charge or if you don't have a trickler dump the outlier charges back into the powder measure hopper and keep going.

Sounds like my build, i have a PSA $80 barrel 1:7 and 1-4x bushnell lol
will do the above mentioned, thanks.

all in succession? so shoot the batch of 5 without taking my eyes off the scope?

Stay on the rifle, if you're new to this breaking your hold may cause more issues than single loading and letting the barrel cool between shots. If you have a heavy trigger that's probably causing issues too because you may be disrupting the hold trying to break the shot without moving the rifle.

I personally go for 10+ shot groups, shows more than a 3-5 shot group. This is not benchrest shooting.

Is that PSA barrel the nitrided one?

The one I bought is. It's the light weight profile too. I was pretty pleased with how well it shot. The barrel is barely free floating with the keymod rail, any pressure by the end of the barrel and the gas block touches the rail. Not sure if that's contributing to the stringing.

My wife shot years of silhouette matches, military rifle matches, NRA high power, etc. so she knows how to pull triggers. She was actually shooting pretty fast when she shot that group. That ammo was actually left over highpower ammo I found in a box when I was setting up my reloading bench again.

Ammo is probably a few years old. Maybe it aged like wine...?? Lol

[RiskyBusiness]

^^^^^^This is part of your problem ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^. Use a contrasting target color, grey, white center, blue etc. Use a target where you can see your crosshair and slice the pie.

Try that before changing all of your load data. I used 55 FMJ's for decades W/ 26.0 of H-335 that gave acceptable accuracy. You're asking too much out of the 55 M-193 FMJ.

That was a single 2" target at 100yds from a 4x. I saw the 4" target just fine. I have multiple manuals stating 25.3 is max for 55gr of h335. Where did you get 26gr from?

[RiskyBusiness]

Is that PSA barrel the nitrided one?

I have the stainless freedom 556/223

[kcstott]

See no one here knows what you are capable of, let alone your rifle, optics, and load.

you have multiple issues.

1, during load work up you want the best highest magnification you can afford. I shoot 25X at 100 and 1000 yards.
2. you are playing with seating depth before you have found a pressure node.
3. once a pressure node is found you can play with seating depth but since this is an AR I'd seat at Nato spec and call it good. and since you will not be playing with seating depth, you pick a load centered on a pressure node and call it good.

I work up loads in less then 50 round with the super fine tuning at the end.
10 rounds to find pressure nodes,
10 rounds 5/5 of the two charges I want to try after narrowing down
5/5/5 of seating depth changes always working toward the lands starting .020 off.
This technique has yet to fail me.

save way more ammo than a true OCW and ladder test.

Funny thing is we take benchrest techniques and apply that to plinking.. thats the problem.
Oh and I've worked up loads once for an ARclose to 30 years ago it is my go to load and never fails, 69 gr SMK 25.4 gr IMR 4895 works all day every day and produces nice .375" groups. from a properly rested 20" barrel 1" groups or slightly smaller from a light 16" barrel.

[17+1]

See no one here knows what you are capable of, let alone your rifle, optics, and load.

you have multiple issues.

1, during load work up you wan the best highest magnification you can afford. I shoot 25X at 100 and 1000 yards.
2. you are playing with seating depth before you have found a pressure node.
3. once a pressure node is found you can play with seating depth but since this is an AR I'd seat at Nato spec and call it good. an since you will not be playing with seating depth, you pick a load centered on a pressure node and call it good.

I work up loads in less then 50 round with the super fine tuning at the end.
10 rounds to find pressure nodes,
10 rounds 5/5 of the two charges I want to try after narrowing down
5/5/5 of seating depth changes always working toward the lands starting .020 off.
This technique has yet to fail me.

save way more ammo than a true OCW and ladder test.

Funny thing is we take benchrest techniques and apply the to plinking.. thats the problem.
Oh and I've worked up loads once for an ARclose to 30 years ago it is my go to load and never fails, 69 gr SMK 25.4 gr IMR 4895 works all day every day and produces nice .375" groups. from a properly rested 20" barrel 1" groups or slightly smaller from a light 16" barrel.

How do you develop loads for a carry handle service rifle? Spend the effort trying to rig up a scope, or go with known and proven data to save time?? Ie advice I gave the OP. I feed a bunch of ARs as most probably do, not worth the effort in my opinion to spend a bunch of time fiddling with all these different loads.

[kcstott]

How do you develop loads for a carry handle service rifle? Spend the effort trying to rig up a scope, or go with known and proven data to save time?? Ie advice I gave the OP. I feed a bunch of ARs as most probably do, not worth the effort in my opinion to spend a bunch of time fiddling with all these different loads.

Which is the point I was trying to make. He's trying to use benchrest techniques on a rifle to be used for plinking. Now just because my load printed a .375" group don't mean that was the intention. I just got lucky.
He's also expecting far too much from his setup. To me the groups look fine for 55 gr non match bullets.

The fact is for me I don't reload .223 for anything other than noise making rounds. If the loads will hold an inch I'm good. But I don't go out of my way to try and produce sub moa loads for a rifle designed for minute of man.

Like I said I worked up a load years ago because at the time that was the only rifle I reloaded for. So I took the time to work up a load long before I knew anything about how to do it.

Now I load .223 the same way I do my hand gun ammo. I check one thing FUNCTION that's it. I could give a damn if the SD & ES is less than 10
Does the ammo go bang and does it hit remotely near my poi? That's it.

I don't shoot three gun. Ipsc, PRS, or any of that stuff. My ARs collect dust more then anything, they are used for camp security and little else.

[FLIGHT762]

Where did you get 26gr from?

From shooting pounds and pounds of H-335 in my SP-1 AR-15's starting in about 1972. H-335 was my first go to powder for the 223. Didn't blow any of them up. I worked up to that load. Worked fine for many years.

I kept an old H-335 canister from that time frame. Still has the price tag of $2.85 on it for the pound.

[RiskyBusiness]

From shooting pounds and pounds of H-335 in my SP-1 AR-15's starting in about 1972. H-335 was my first go to powder for the 223. Didn't blow any of them up. I worked up to that load. Worked fine for many years.

I kept an old H-335 canister from that time frame. Still has the price tag of $2.85 on it for the pound.

From what I read h335 has changed over the years. Have you used any of the recent years batches with that load?

[OpenSightsOnly]

From what I read h335 has changed over the years. Have you used any of the recent years batches with that load?

If you want a faster burning powder for a gas gun, use H4895 or IMR 8208XBR.