hone sizing die?

[thenotoriousmo]

when reloading for my 338 norma i was wondering how much my necks were being worked so i removed the expander and sized a few and found that they were being worked from a fired diameter of about .367 (going of memmory as i forgot to write it down) down .358. a loaded case measured .365. everything else i reload has a neck tension of .002/3 done by FL bushing dies

these are forster dies and ive heard that they offer a service to hone the die, but my question is that should i just let them be? everything is very consistent and run out is low and if this was any other brass i probably wouldn't care to much about over working the neck. but at almost 2 buck a piece, i would like the 200 pieces i have to last the life of the barrel without splitting any necks (7-8 fireings with annealing every 3rd).

lots of extra information which most probably isn't relevant for a simple question, should i hone the die or just leave it as is?

[bsumoba]

leave it as is. IMO, honing won't increase life. so it looks like your die is sizing it down to 358, then your expander is expanding it. Solution...anneal more often than every three firings. If you can, at minimum do every other firing. That will mitigate split necks as much as possible.

In reality, you will probably see primer pockets go out first than split necks if you anneal often. the only way to increase primer pocket life is to not load rounds hot.

[J-cat]

Honing will increase case life and reduce runout. What you want is the die to bring the fired neck diameter down a couple thou under loaded diameter. That way you'll have good neck tension just like factory new brass.

[milotrain]

Throating reamer down the die, bushing die, or custom die from Whidden or Harrells. I doubt honing the forester die will get you the neck clearance you want on the die. Make sure your comp seater die isn't also crunching the necks once you've expanded the sizing die.

[J-cat]

Why do you doubt that? Forster can open up the neck by .007"

[drdarrin@sbcglobal.net]

A word of caution. Brass thickness varies by manufacturer and lot. Reaming the neck of your die to meet the needs of this particular lot of brass you have may result in unsatisfactory results with a new lot of brass. Just sayin....

[milotrain]

Why do you doubt that? Forster can open up the neck by .007"

Because I've never had a Forester sizing die that I liked. I've had a few comp seater dies that I liked, but their sizing dies have always had some hassle.

A word of caution. Brass thickness varies by manufacturer and lot. Reaming the neck of your die to meet the needs of this particular lot of brass you have may result in unsatisfactory results with a new lot of brass. Just sayin....

It's 338 norma, so he's likely using Norma (should be anyway) which means his neck consistencies should be good. But if he's custom making a die for a lot of brass he better be well down the rabbit hole of benchrest style reloading practices.

[thenotoriousmo]

i am using 200 pieces of norma brass and they are all from the same lot. I've measured the brass thickness and it is pretty consistent at .013ish. but i am using calipers and am doing as good as in can as i don't have gauge pins or an anvil mic, so take the measurement with a grain of salt but everything adds up.

also im not sure if I'm ready or even want to be considered to be at bench rest reloading standards as i don't dont even do the easy things such as sort brass or bullets by weight/bearing surface. i just want the brass to last the life of the barrel as long as i keep the load reasonable so i don't wear the primer pockets out

[milotrain]

I simply meant that you likely had the tools to ensure case wall consistency if you were bothering to get a custom sizing die. I would recommend a ball mic, as they are pretty cheap, or you can make something that works well with a dial indicator and a K&M expander anvil.

If you are using Norma Brass and good bullets like Berger then you aren't going to get much from sorting. 200 cases should last you a long time, but I'd still look for a bushing die, especially if you are not playing the benchrest game and don't care about the nth degree of concentricity.

[LynnJr]

You are getting 0.002 neck tension now and you gain nothing by taking the brass down further than needed.
I would hone the die and avoid the extra work on the brass.
I am shooting a 338 Norma Improved with 88 grains of H1000 and a 300 grain Sierra.
Fire forming my brass it put 37 rounds into a 1 inch group. Loaded length is 3.604 inches and accuracy is outstanding.

[thenotoriousmo]

i found out that it's only 12 bucks and around 2 weeks for forster to hone the die. so for that price i don't see why not just do it and save the money that would be for a new bushing die and spend it on a box of bergers.

Because I've never had a Forester sizing die that I liked. I've had a few comp seater dies that I liked, but their sizing dies have always had some hassle.

out of curiosity, what exactly did you not like about their sizer?

[JMP]

Has anyone tried using the Redding neck only bushing dies for 338 Lapua? Would that work, or is there too much difference in case?

[milotrain]

out of curiosity, what exactly did you not like about their sizer?

I've had two only so maybe I got unlucky but the FL 223 sizer I had way overworked brass and had a tendency to stick. I took a fireformed case from a tight 223 match chamber and it still took STROKE to run it in their FL die. It almost felt like the die was made with a worn out resizing reamer. I've never stuck cases with imperial before, and I've got a pile of 223 sizers, on inspection the die was rougher on it's interior than any I've had from other manufacturers. The decapping system is a joke, everyone else's with replaceable pins is stouter, I caught an off center flash hole on a run of crimped mil brass and the pin broke (no big deal, happens all the time) but it wasn't the pin that broke, it was the threaded stem that went into the die. So the extra pin they supply wasn't usable.

Both dies went into the trash. I kept the body of the die with the broken stem around just to have a big overworker body die in the case that I found MG brass or something like that but then I got a case stuck in that die too.

[J-cat]

You should have sent it back.

I have two of their .308 small base dies with .335" and .334" necks and they are superb. They bump my shoulder .002" with a standard shell holder. A standard .308 die has a .328" neck and .007" on top of that is as much as they are comfortable doing. They told me anymore than that and the neck becomes eccentric.

[milotrain]

I had dies that worked and by the time the second one was ****ting the bed I didn't feel like there was a good chance that I was going to get anything I wanted by sending them back.

General consensus is to run necks down no more than .005", I'm sure .007" is fine, but that's another good reason for bushings. If you want a loose neck chamber (some believe that in certain calibers that's a good thing) then you can run all your brass through an FL with -.005" and then a neck die with whatever more you need knocked off.