Looking at new computer (mac) & wondering why

[FatCity67]

As I type this on an original iPad....... I wonder why there is always so much hate for apple.

But first to your op. I suspect a very large percentage of the "refurbished" units had nothing wrong with them. They just got scrubbed.

Second, our household has enjoyed 3 iPads, 3 iMacs, 1 mini Mac, 1 air book, 1 Mac book and at least 5 iPhones.

Only 2 of those units actually died. My son used to take his Mac book camping and events like burning man. I'm sure it was full of dirt and abused when it quit. One iPhone quit charging because my wife used to play music while showering. The charging port corroded from being in a steam filled environment every day.

Every other unit we have still works 100% with one exception. The 2005ish iMac has some streaking in the monitor.

Funny because all the pcs (which have been many at my office) I've owned worked fine too. Very few actual failures.

Maybe some people just beat their machines?

I have to agree. I've got three generations of Ipads at my house that all Still function perfectly even the First Gen. Thing is like a tank. All the ipads where my kids while going thru high school before off to college. Let just say they were not treated lightly as all the kids were year round athletes.

I doubt very seriously most PC laptops could have stood up to the same usage with out some internal damage.

[user120312]

There are so many refurbished Mac's out there, pages & pages of them, what's up ?

People apparently make money selling refreshed used stuff. If you'd like to rewind 25 years or so I can sell you a beautiful 7100 PPC complete with a built-in DOS/Windows board. Got it sitting right out there in the shop. Hard to imagine I paid nearly 10 grand of 1990's money for that whole system. Still runs though.

I google why, but found nothing on the subject, just lots & lots of them for sale.

A lot of people buy stuff, use stuff and sell stuff. Whole generations were indoctrinated into the Apple cult

I'm considering a mac, & thinking why ? I should even consider a used one over new, or are they really just junk, because so many are used (refurbished units) out in the market.

IDK, if you like or want to try the Mac OS, a used product is an inexpensive way to get into the platform.

I type in New I-Mac but get mostly listings for refurbished/used units.

Tons of college students got/get them as presents sending them off to education land and any sales are pure profit so, heh.

What say CG's ?

Last new Mac I bought was a Powerbook 5300c in early1996. Ever since I've always bought used. That old PB, costing around 4 grand back then, still runs, although of course slower than molasses compared to the new MacBook Pro this is being typed on.

Traditionally, I purchased most of the units on eBay from well-reviewed independent computer techs and generally have been, if anything, embarrassed that I in no way treat them as pristine as the guys I bought them from.

Good luck with your choice.

[wpage]

Like the iphone. MACs are crap get the good stuff and migrate.

[allright]

If you're interested in buying a refurb mac, get it from directly from Apple. Decent savings and warranty. That's all we've bought personally and for business. Never had an issue.

This^^^^^^^
Now that I'm no longer at Apple and can't get employee discounts, I almost always buy refurbs from Apple.com. They come in a plain brown box as opposed to the beautiful new packaging, and they have a new computer/other product warranty. I'll usually buy an extended warranty off of ebay for half the price (do you research on the seller). This has worked well for me. I have, in the past, bought an almost new Mac off of Craig's List, that still has Apple Care (warranty) on it. I usually buy more than I need, so the need to upgrade can be put off. about 3 yrs ago, I purchased a 9 month old MacBook Pro from CL. I wanted the last model to have an optical drive. Bought it, extended the Apple care on the cheap, removed the optical drive, moved the existing 750 gig HD to the location vacated by the optical drive, and installed a OWC SSD where the original HD was. It's plenty fast! and lots of storage.

[Dragunov]

Thank you all for the input.

And thank Dargunov:

You sound like you know something about these, so thank you for you honesty on the matter.

I will look deeper into these units. Lenovo Y410/520p or used ? MSI & Alienware, this last one will probably not be for me, as I don't game, & understand this to be a gamer's dream machine. Nephew has one lol.

You are very welcome .

That's because I've worked on them. They really are a nightmare to fix. I have more laptops in my house right now, than most 3 people will own in their lifetimes. I work on them every day. I rebuild laptops from scratch (so to speak) every day.

Y410/510p, MSI, and Alienware (now built by Dell), and Asus ROG, are all Gamers laptops. Out of the three, The MSI is the best in my opinion. Not by much, but they're excellent machines, followed closely by the Lenovo, then Alienware, then the ROG's.

I recommend Gaming platform laptops, for anyone who don't mind paying some extra Ducketts for their computer. This is because they are just, plain, better for every application. Better to have too much, than not enough .

Yes, used. Any of these can be purchased off Ebay (both new, and used). I've had very good luck with machines I've purchased from Ebay to upgrade/fix. There are some real, killer deals if you know what you're doing.

I rebuild these, and sell them to people doing everything from spreadsheets, CAD, and any type of graphic arts, to surfing the internet, etc.

Gaming laptops not only will outclass any other platform (better business machine, than business class machines), the build quality is off the charts in most of these. They tend to be a little heavier, and a shorter battery life than other classes. Although, my personal Y410p, and Y510p machines can get up to 6 hours, if I put them in power saver mode.

As these are my daily drivers, to me, they're nothing but small, killer desktop gaming rigs, that will do anything, with convenient battery backup. As such, I pretty much keep them in "High Performance" (Power Pig) mode.

The nice thing about the right Laptop? You can upgrade the processor, ram, and in some cases Video, instead of buying a new machine every couple years.

Best ones for upgradability?

MSI.
Lenovo (NOT the "Slim" models).
Alienware.
Toshiba Tecra, and Portage.
Asus "K" series (K53e is probably the best laptop ever built by Asus), and ROG.

There are many others, but these are the best build quality laptops on the market. Toughbooks are probably the best built laptops, but tend to not be so upgradable. That's why I didn't mention them.

Anything high end Sandy bridge, and up can usually be upgraded quite a bit IF it doesn't have soldered in chips. you can, under a lot of circumstances, upgrade to a higher generation chip. You will most likely need to flash your BIOS first. The "Ivy bridge" architecture, is the most versatile for upgrades!

FLYLINER:

I'm so confident in the PC-laptops I rebuild, I give them limited-lifetime warranties.... NEVER had to replace one... Ever! I've had to do minor repairs only, and even then, only a few times.

Can't do this with a Macbook.

[ramathorn]

I bought a MacBook in 2008. At the time it was awesome but I went back to pc after windows 7 was released and haven't looked back. I'm sticking with Windows, the OS is much better now (IMO) and the hardware on Windows computers is much better than on mac products, at least for the price. That said, get what you want. Either will operate well if you know what you're doing. If you buy refurbished get it from Apple directly as others have said.

[blackberg]

If you'd like to rewind 25 years or so I can sell you a beautiful 7100 PPC complete with a built-in DOS/Windows board. Got it sitting right out there in the shop. Hard to imagine I paid nearly 10 grand of 1990's money for that whole system. Still runs though.

wow, that was my first computer of my own, 7100 ppc. remember first time I bought ram for it.

Been a mac guy since before then. Rarely buy new, always used or refurbished. I used to be a consultant as well and knew people who were connected with corporate, at least back then some "refurbs" came from them pulling stock from the distributors before a new model came out, holding them and then selling them at a discount after a while.

-bb

[xSlapshotx]

I own a lot of apple products. I don't like computers, don't like to tinker with them, don't want to upgrade them. My Macs just work without drama. But then I don't game on it or do a lot of video editing or whatever PCs are good for.

I've bought refurbished MacBooks for my kids to take to college and haven't had any issues

Macs are to computers as a Prius is to transportation.

[ExtremeX]

I own a lot of apple products. I don't like computers, don't like to tinker with them, don't want to upgrade them. My Macs just work without drama. But then I don't game on it or do a lot of video editing or whatever PCs are good for.

I've bought refurbished MacBooks for my kids to take to college and haven't had any issues

Macs are to computers as a Prius is to transportation.

That comment might hold true on the old way of doing things...

Look at the products made by MS... Surface, Surface Book , Surface Studio...

Its even nicer than what Apple has these days. No tinkering, no issues, and no Genius required. Even a full system restore in a Win 10 environment is painless.

I have Apple stuff too but even for the artist they are doing things better than Apple. No touch except for iOS. No tablets with a real OS. I don't even need a Wacom anymore.

I can run Windows on my MAC, but the MS hardware is better, so instead of being a fan boy I bought something that was actually awesome.

[ocabj]

That comment might hold true on the old way of doing things...

Look at the products made by MS... Surface, Surface Book , Surface Studio...

Its even nicer than what Apple has these days. No tinkering, no issues, and no Genius required. Even a full system restore in a Win 10 environment is painless.

The reason why the Surface is actually good is because it is essentially a Microsoft computer running Microsoft's OS, just like a Mac is an Apple computer running Apple's OS. Microsoft built hardware that they are supporting to integrate with their OS. They are in the position to optimize and address any hardware to OS issues due to the 'finite' hardware they need to focus on.

As opposed to any other computer builder (e.g. Dell, HP, Alienware) who are at the mercy of any changes MS makes to the OS that could result in breaking changes to drivers for hardware that the other vendors (e.g. ATI, NVidia) wrote, or to their own drivers (e.g. motherboard chipsets).

I was actually considering a Surface Pro and a few of my colleagues have been running them these past couple years with more than satisfactory results (specifically when it comes to O365 apps). But the price of a good Surface is pretty high and I would rather not invest that much money into a Windows machine, at least until the Windows Subsystem for Linux matures significantly.

[Flyliner]

Uuuugghhhh people!! They are just f'ing tools. Period!

I work in advertising and we are 100% exclusively Mac. Best tools for that job. When I built my own firewall, I built Supermicro with BSD. Best tool for the job. When my wife needed a computer for work I built her a top notch PC since she is in a corporate environment. Best tool for the job. For our personal home computers and cell phones we use Apple/Mac since we like the ecosystem/integration, and work well for my young son. Best tool for the job. I built a Linux box for network monitoring/server tasks. Best tool for the job. When my son starts learning programming I will build him a PC first, then a Linux box when he gets to that level. Best two tools for the job. Our gaming rig, a PC. Best tool for the job. See the trend here?

People seem to forget this and get all wrapped up in Mac vs PC, Ford vs Chevy, Daniel Defense vs LaRue vs AP vs Noveske vs Bravo Co, etc, etc, etc..

The reliability issue has nothing to do with the platform, its all about the components. When using top quality components both platforms are just as reliable. And all platforms have had their lemons too. (People seem to forget that Macs and PCs use the same hardware these days, Intel processors, GeForce/Radeon, etc..).

Macs have their strengths and work well for certain people for certain reasons/tasks. PCs have their strengths and work well for certian people for certian reasons/tasks. Choose the right tool for the right job. Its that simple...

[NYT]

(People seem to forget that Macs and PCs use the same hardware these days, Intel processors, GeForce/Radeon, etc..).

yup, they sure do. the debate here is if its worth the price (for a refurb) seeing how mac is always a generation behind.

if you go buy a brand new $2500 macbook pro like mine today, it will come with an i7 cpu... a skylake cpu.

if you go buy a dell, it will be an i7... but the new kaby lake cpu.

so that means you just paid a premium price for a processor that came out two years ago.

[therealnickb]

yup, they sure do. the debate here is if its worth the price (for a refurb) seeing how mac is always a generation behind.

if you go buy a brand new $2500 macbook pro like mine today, it will come with an i7 cpu... a skylake cpu.

if you go buy a dell, it will be an i7... but the new kaby lake cpu.

so that means you just paid a premium price for a processor that came out two years ago.

IDK. Seems to me the hardware of any machine is "outdated" PDQ.

I'm paying apple prices because my wife can actually figure out how to use her machine without bugging me.

[therealnickb]

Macs have their strengths and work well for certain people for certain reasons/tasks. PCs have their strengths and work well for certian people for certian reasons/tasks. Choose the right tool for the right job. Its that simple...

Exactly. See my comments above.

[NYT]

IDK. Seems to me the hardware of any machine is "outdated" PDQ.

I'm paying apple prices because my wife can actually figure out how to use her machine without bugging me.

yup, that is a perfectly valid reason and why i as well purchase macs for my grandparents and mother. my dad likes android so he got a samsung tablet and phone. my mom got my old note 5 but ipads and an imac.