What is the purpose of having a maximum $35 PPT fee

[Creampuff]

I remember in 1999 CA started a law to force gasoline stations to have to give out Air and Water for free. After awhile most stations started to let the air and water pumps go into a state of disrepair.

I can't blame them because why should the state come in and force them to give a service away. Air might be free, but the pump isn't free to maintain. And water certainly isn't free to the owner.

So I'm curious, why are we ok with the state coming in and forcing FFL's to have to operate at a loss. If the PPT fee is $25 DROS, which I assume goes to the state, and $10 to the FFL, then they will be operating at a loss.

Shouldn't the free market also dictate the cost of PPT rather than the state? What is the purpose of locking the PPT to $35?

I don't want to pay more than I need to but at the same rate, I think the free market should dictate prices.

[TRICKSTER]

It is because the state mandated that transfers go through a FFL, people don't have any choice but to use their service. For FFLs it's the price of doing business in CA and as far as operating at a loss, it's getting customers into your shop and if you know what your doing, you can turn that into a benefit instead of a loss.

[FourTenJaeger]

I enjoy the fact that I never have to pay an FFL fee.

[Obviously a Plant]

In a "free market" the State would not mandate a monopoly on where and how (and to whom or how often or what type or what caliber or if it had a magazine inside or outside the grip or that other grip forward or behind the magazine...) you transfer a firearm.

As it stands, many gun shops resent that they have to process "unprofitable PPT's" and show that by wasting hours of your time, or dictating when you can do a PPT or however else they might choose to disrespect you in the name of giving the finger to the Man who made you walk in their door in the first place.

If you want to have them charge whatever they wish, just buy guns from out of state vendors (or private parties, if they dare) and ask your LGS to tack on whatever sort of fee they want to make their own stock look competitive.

Do a quick search here and you can find a store or two that charges "market rates" for PPT's- go be their only customer.

[sumdood]

Raise the fee too much and people will stop transferring at dealers and use parking lots. Simple as that.

As Trickster mentioned in regards to the FFL, cost of doing business. Oh, and in a "free market", who the heck would even use an FFL?

[FullAuto]

Raise the fee too much and people will stop transferring at dealers and use parking lots. Simple as that.

As Trickster mentioned in regards to the FFL, cost of doing business. Oh, and in a "free market", who the heck would even use an FFL?

Exactly. We have been oppressed and had our inalienable rights taken from us for so long that now the argument or questions have turned into debating the fairness of the legalities THEY have created. The original argument and fact that the 2nd Amendment of the U.S. Constitution gives every citizen of this country the RIGHT to keep and bear arms has now been lost as some kind of antiquated notion. That's creeping incrementalism for you.....

[Fjold]

One of the assumptions that you make is that the FL is operating at a loss whenever they do a PPT. Since any competent FL can do a PPT in less than 15 minutes without turning away any other paying customer, they lose nothing doing PPTs. It's not like they are hiring extra people to do PPTs or are having other people walk out because they don't get helped.

I've seen one person gunshops do PPTs and manage customer service without a problem. In almost every instance where I've seen gunshops complain about doing PPTs it's from shops that have a lot of people already complaining about the shop's customer service. Read all the posts about people complaining about not getting PPTs handled at a shop, in almost every case they mention that the counter help is standing around talking with each other and not serving other customers but they all seem to have more than enough time to whine and complain about not wanting to do PPTs.

Any good business person can see the advantages of getting more foot traffic through their shop. If I go in to do a PPT in a shop and have a good trouble-free experience with quality customer service, I am much more likely to do business with that shop in the future and tell other people about it.

In Bakersfield we are lucky in having a lot of gunshops to pick from but only three of them get any business from me, the three that have great attitudes and exceptional customer service.

[ohsmily]

See all of the above. We shouldn't have to go through a dealer to sell our property but since we do, the state caps the fee so people don't just do it in the parking lot due to high fees.

Also, why the f do you think it is a loss to process PPTs? what is your data? They can be done quickly and efficiently. Also, you get TWO potential customers in the door as opposed to them doing a transaction in a parking lot somewhere.

[yzErnie]

PPT's are time consuming for little to no profit. That said an as Fjold said, as long as both parties are ready and have everything they need with them, it can be done pretty quickly. IMO, PPT's are not that big of a deal. I have had many PPT customers return for their gun purchase(s).

[yzErnie]

See all of the above. We shouldn't have to go through a dealer to sell our property but since we do, the state caps the fee so people don't just do it in the parking lot due to high fees.

Also, why the f do you think it is a loss to process PPTs? what is your data? They can be done quickly and efficiently. Also, you get TWO potential customers in the door as opposed to them doing a transaction in a parking lot somewhere.

The PPT itself is a net loss but the potential for additional business outweighs that in our minds.

[JGalt]

They mandate a plethora of things the business must comply with including minimum wage, business licensing to include FFL, insurance, compliance posters, blah blah blah... and you are bugging about a $10 mandate?

If you really want a free market, lose the State. I get rules. Rulers not so much.

[TeddyBallgame]

It is because the state mandated that transfers go through a FFL, people don't have any choice but to use their service. For FFLs it's the price of doing business in CA and as far as operating at a loss, it's getting customers into your shop and if you know what your doing, you can turn that into a benefit instead of a loss.

great analogy

even in the "free market" many business' have what they call a "lost leader", an item that is priced either so low that, they make no real money off of it, or very little...maybe an item they need to move in great quantities in order to realize a decent profit

my uncle owned a radiator distributorship, hired me to work for him one summer after school let out...huge place in Wilmington, lots of different sized radiator cores that he sold to all the body and repair shops, dealerships

one particular radiator moved like hot cakes, a few hundred a month easy...it was generally the most installed radiator in cars being driven, fit many different American model vehicles

one evening during a conversation, he told me they only make a "few bucks" on each of those radiators, it was their lost leader...when i asked him why they would sell the most bought radiator on the market with so little profit, he told me there were 3 reasons

one: a competitive market with other manufacturers was always a factor

two: he was able to order from his manufacturer in much higher volume, therefore getting him a better discount, also lowering his cost

three: he pulled out an invoice from a Ford dealership in Long Beach...showed me where he sold them 10 of the lost leaders, and, another 54 different mixed size radiator cores from his stock...he extended out the invoice for me, cost, and, resell price to show me that, while he only made $30.00 on the 10 fast movers, he profited over $2700.00 on the remaining 54 radiator cores that Ford ordered from him also

basically it came down to the cost of doing business...im sure a good LGS can find a way to take that $10.00 "lost leader" and turn it into a profit by also selling other accessories to all comers...one of the biggest challenges in retail sales is getting people IN your door...after that, the rest is really just a matter of having something else the customer wants...people impulse buy all the time

may not be that way every time with PPT's, but, it's kind of like the strategy of asking out only the most gorgeous woman...one out of the bunch might say "yes"

[elsolo]

The gunship that does quick and easy ppt's usually became my go-to gunship for everything.

[JagerDog]

For the same reason I seldom buy anything from Reed's (most difficult PPT program I've dealt with). We get to see who's interested in serving customers and who just wants their thumb on the scale.

[sigfan91]

I don't want to pay more than I need to but at the same rate, I think the free market should dictate prices.

This ceased to be a "free market" when the government dictated how we conduct our business.