Question about auto sear

[Wallabing]

Is it possible to "demill" an ar15 auto sear? Like would cutting it in half make it legal to own?

[-hanko]

Is it possible to "demill" an ar15 auto sear? Like would cutting it in half make it legal to own?

Like it would make it legal if it were cut in half.

But, like why the magic in like owning it, like if it were cut in half?

[Cali-Shooter]

A legally transferable (only in a free state) auto sear runs about 8,000 to 9,000. Why would you demill one?

[fiddletown]

A legally transferable (only in a free state) auto sear runs about 8,000 to 9,000. Why would you demill one?

But an auto sear that's not legally transferable (no tax stamp) runs up to 10 years in federal prison.

[Cannon-Arms]

But an auto sear that's not legally transferable (no tax stamp) runs up to 10 years in federal prison.

Wouldn't that be only if you have the complimentary weapon with special hole drilled, ready to accept it?

A lot of AK parts kits came with auto sears and disconnectors in the trigger groups. No hole in receiver, it's useless.

Mind ya, I'm not a lawyer, didn't stay in a holiday inn, and I have no illusion that if one were to run afoul of BATF&OtherAssortedScaryThings, while performing a colonoscopy on yer life, they'd find a way to jam said trigger group pieces in a gun just to get it to miss fire two round/one trigger pull.

BAMF! you fight'n to stay outa jail.

[Quiet]

Wouldn't that be only if you have the complimentary weapon with special hole drilled, ready to accept it?

A lot of AK parts kits came with auto sears and disconnectors in the trigger groups. No hole in receiver, it's useless.

Mind ya, I'm not a lawyer, didn't stay in a holiday inn, and I have no illusion that if one were to run afoul of BATF&OtherAssortedScaryThings, while performing a colonoscopy on yer life, they'd find a way to jam said trigger group pieces in a gun just to get it to miss fire two round/one trigger pull.

BAMF! you fight'n to stay outa jail.

Nope. Auto-sear by itself is considered a MG.



Penal Code 16880
(a) As used in this part, "machinegun" means any weapon that shoots, is designed to shoot, or can readily be restored to shoot, automatically more than one shot, without manual reloading, by a single function of the trigger.
(b) The term "machinegun" also includes the frame or receiver of any weapon described in subdivision (a), any part designed and intended solely and exclusively, or combination of parts designed and intended, for use in converting a weapon into a machinegun, and any combination of parts from which a machinegun can be assembled if those parts are in the possession or under the control of a person.
(c) The term "machinegun" also includes any weapon deemed by the federal Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms and Explosives as readily convertible to a machinegun under Chapter 53 (commencing with Section 5801) of Title 26 of the United States Code.

26 USC 5845
For the purpose of this chapter—
(b) Machinegun
The term “machinegun” means any weapon which shoots, is designed to shoot, or can be readily restored to shoot, automatically more than one shot, without manual reloading, by a single function of the trigger. The term shall also include the frame or receiver of any such weapon, any part designed and intended solely and exclusively, or combination of parts designed and intended, for use in converting a weapon into a machinegun, and any combination of parts from which a machinegun can be assembled if such parts are in the possession or under the control of a person.

[Falstaff]

someone better notify SARCO and Sportsmans guide as they still ship parts kits with the Asears in them...

[-hanko]

A legally transferable (only in a free state) auto sear runs about 8,000 to 9,000. Why would you demill one?

See below...

But an auto sear that's not legally transferable (no tax stamp) runs up to 10 years in federal prison.

See below...

Wouldn't that be only if you have the complimentary weapon with special hole drilled, ready to accept it?

A lot of AK parts kits came with auto sears and disconnectors in the trigger groups. No hole in receiver, it's useless.

Correct...see below.

Nope. Auto-sear by itself is considered a MG.

Penal Code 16880
(a) As used in this part, "machinegun" means any weapon that shoots, is designed to shoot, or can readily be restored to shoot, automatically more than one shot, without manual reloading, by a single function of the trigger.
(b) The term "machinegun" also includes the frame or receiver of any weapon described in subdivision (a), any part designed and intended solely and exclusively, or combination of parts designed and intended, for use in converting a weapon into a machinegun, and any combination of parts from which a machinegun can be assembled if those parts are in the possession or under the control of a person.
(c) The term "machinegun" also includes any weapon deemed by the federal Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms and Explosives as readily convertible to a machinegun under Chapter 53 (commencing with Section 5801) of Title 26 of the United States Code.

26 USC 5845
For the purpose of this chapter—
(b) Machinegun
The term “machinegun” means any weapon which shoots, is designed to shoot, or can be readily restored to shoot, automatically more than one shot, without manual reloading, by a single function of the trigger. The term shall also include the frame or receiver of any such weapon, any part designed and intended solely and exclusively, or combination of parts designed and intended, for use in converting a weapon into a machinegun, and any combination of parts from which a machinegun can be assembled if such parts are in the possession or under the control of a person.

There's more than a bit of confusion here related to the difference between an AR auto sear, which is part of a group of parts to allow the weapon to fire either full-auto or 3-shot bursts, depending on the combination of parts in the group...

and a drop-in auto sear (aka DIAS), which is a single part that replaces the oem combo of parts and allows full-auto by itself.

Posters might want to check the legality of the individual part, as shipped in kits by SAMCO Global and others (hint...not any part designed and intended solely...) , v. a DIAS (a part designed and intended solely...), prior to posting.

Another hint...an auto sear, not a DIAS, is similar to an M16 bolt in that respect.

[fiddletown]

...There's more than a bit of confusion here related to the difference between an AR auto sear, which is part of a group of parts to allow the weapon to fire either full-auto or 3-shot bursts, depending on the combination of parts in the group...

Okay, then the real question is, "What does the OP actually have?"

If it's a part that is legal to own without a tax stamp, there's no reason for his question, and Cali-Shooter's comment in post 3 about a legally transferable auto-sear being valuable is inapplicable.

If it's a part that's not legal to own without a tax stamp, the OP has serious problems if he doesn't have the tax stamp (and California problems even if he does).

[HonkingAntelope]

like this?

[-hanko]

Okay, then the real question is, "What does the OP actually have?"

If it's a part that is legal to own without a tax stamp, there's no reason for his question, and Cali-Shooter's comment in post 3 about a legally transferable auto-sear being valuable is inapplicable.

If it's a part that's not legal to own without a tax stamp, the OP has serious problems if he doesn't have the tax stamp (and California problems even if he does).

Based on the OP..."an ar15 auto sear"...

The question wouldn't have been asked, I think, if OP had been out of state and gone to the time and trouble to get a tax stamp for a DIAS.

Assuming he has a stamped DIAS, he's in deep poop if it's in California...no permission from BATFE to move the DIAS, and no approval from the state.

Ergo, my answer was based on an auto sear for an oem AR.

[Cannon-Arms]

Yeah, a lot of confusion...I.E. M-16 bolt carrier being preferred in most AR builds, is also a part needed for machine gun capabilities, along with special hole, FA safety and trigger group.

Minus the hole and disconnector, all ya need is a DIAS.

DIAS are machine guns in and of themselves, serialized and tax stamped.

My understanding was, A DIAS is a machine gun, regardless of whether you have a AR patterned rifle or not.

M16 trigger groups are not, and as long as you do not have a AR patterned rifle, there's no constructive possession.

Please reference my credentials in my prior post, and Mr. cool guy ATF agent perusing this thread, I have none of the above. this is just academic discussion.
Actually, I hate guns, evil, yuck puke...(spit)

See, I'm cool!

[Cannon-Arms]

like this?

[img]htt://www2.fiskars.com/var/fiskars_amer/storage/images/frontpage2/kids-activities-school/products/kids-scissors/blunt-tip-kids-scissors-5/16059-14-eng-US/Blunt-tip-Kids-Scissors-5_product_main.png[/img]

Minus the scissors, that has already been deemed a machine gun by ATF&WeHateYouPion, it was a shoe string I believe, the original dude busted over.

[CK_32]

This has bad news written all over it.


If your like 90% of the other people who ask how to have a non functional sear/suppressor or fun stuff but just try to be sly and asked if you can legally have a non functional one to have an out if you ever get busted. Just don't do it.

Just go to NV and hit a F/A gun rental range and get your fix. It's only fun so many times especially after you crunch the numbers for the wasted F/A fun.

[audiophil2]

Is it possible to "demill" an ar15 auto sear? Like would cutting it in half make it legal to own?

Cutting to the point of it being useless would not be an issue.

A legally transferable (only in a free state) auto sear runs about 8,000 to 9,000. Why would you demill one?

Actually a legally transferable AR15 auto sear is about $20-30. It is not regulated. They can be found in M16 parts kits.
An AR15 RDIAS is closer to $23,000-30,000.

Nope. Auto-sear by itself is considered a MG.

Then all the parts kits sellers are conducting illegal transfers.

Yeah, a lot of confusion...I.E. M-16 bolt carrier being preferred in most AR builds, is also a part needed for machine gun capabilities, along with special hole, FA safety and trigger group.

Minus the hole and disconnector, all ya need is a DIAS.

DIAS are machine guns in and of themselves, serialized and tax stamped.

My understanding was, A DIAS is a machine gun, regardless of whether you have a AR patterned rifle or not.

M16 trigger groups are not, and as long as you do not have a AR patterned rifle, there's no constructive possession.

Please reference my credentials in my prior post, and Mr. cool guy ATF agent perusing this thread, I have none of the above. this is just academic discussion.
Actually, I hate guns, evil, yuck puke...(spit)

See, I'm cool!

DIAS are considered machine guns but some can be owned as long as there is no host gun nearby. post 81 DIAS are not grandfathered in. Neither have tax stamps.

RDIAS have tax stamps and form 4's or are on form 3's and are fully transferable in NFA legal states.




Big difference between this AR15 auto sear circled in red and a DIAS or RDIAS.


As far as full auto being a waste I would strongly disagree. I sell plenty of guns locally to customers that come out and play with my full autos. When I have someone on the fence deciding if he wants to spend $4-30,000 on a full auto gun I just let him run a few mags through one of my $150 full auto lowers. Even my customers that only buy uppers from me like to try out their uppers on my full auto lowers. No one ever gets bored or complains about the money.

Here is a beater $150 lower I use for demo's. Once it gets too mucked up from abuse it just gets cut up and another one replaces it.