which would you get, fn fal or ptr 91?

[BHPFan]

The Germans had the G1...FN told them to FOAD since the memories of WWII were still very fresh.

Well, it's true that FN told the Germans to FOAD due to fresh WW2 memories, but that's due to that the Germans asked for a license to build G1s themselves.

Kinda ironic that by not getting a license to build G1s, them Germans went ahead to try other rifles and adopt the G3 (based on the Spanish CETME Modelo B), which ended up being the FAL's biggest competitor.

Not French, Belgian.

[bsut]

I just couldn't take myself seriously, shooting a gun with a French name!

Not French, Belgian.

Yes, I know the rifle is Belgian. I made a derogatory slam on its French name, not its country of origin. The Belgians make very nice chocolate and waffles and frites and lagers, but I have no first-hand experience with their skill at manufacturing things like weapons. The Germans are pretty good at manufacturing things like vehicles (of which I own several) and weapons (which design I selected among the list of 7.62 NATO battle rifle candidates). The French are pretty good at making food, not so good at making war (which is why I slammed the FN FAL's name), but they're only in this thread because the Belgians sometimes use their language.

Yes, I know there are difference between the French and Flemish languages, since the two are used on opposite sides of the map and schedule boards on the subway platforms in Brussels and Zaventem, and wherever the hell else we were when got lost trying to read the subway system's maps and schedules.

[BHPFan]

The Belgians make very nice chocolate and waffles and frites and lagers, but I have no first-hand experience with their skill at manufacturing things like weapons. The Germans are pretty good at manufacturing things like vehicles (of which I own several) and weapons (which design I selected among the list of 7.62 NATO battle rifle candidates).

OK. Let's see at the weapons that Belgians have manufactured:
Browning High Power pistol - enough said
FAL rifle - enough said
Browning Auto-5 shotgun.
FNC rifle - adopted in Belgium and also manufactured under license in Indonesia and Sweden, where it replaced the G3 http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/FN_FNC
F2000 (FS2000 for civilians) - adopted by Slovenia and other countries' special forces. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/FN_F2000
P90 (PS90 for civilians) http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/FN_P90#Variants
SCAR rifle - Don't tell me you never heard of it.http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/FN_SCAR
SLP semi-auto shotgun.
TPS pump shotgun.
MAG 58 (known in our military as the M240) - you should recognize that one. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/FN_MAG
Minimi (known in our military as the M249) - You should recognize that one as well.http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/FN_Minimi
Karabiner 98K, also known as the Mauser rifle.
SPR Bolt Action Rifle - used by the FBI
Five-Seven pistol http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/FN_Five-seven


Also, they also made the following under license:
UZI, under license from IMI.
Model 1930 BAR, a licensed version of the BAR in 8mm Mauser.
M2 Browning machine gun http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/M2_Browning_machine_gun
M16 by government contract in its facility in South Carolina (FNH USA)
M4A1 by government contract also in its facility in SC (FNH USA)

There may be more firearms produced by FN that I have not listed. Now, any doubts about the Belgians' skill to manufacture weapons?

[GW]

Just because it should be mentioned.

If you are not giving M1As a hard look and you live in Kommiefornistan you are missing out. (no bullet button nonsense).

I have both a FAL and A M1A and if I had to keep only one it would be the M1A hands down.
And my M1A is a springfield, not a high end LRB or SEI, or even a Norinco or Polytech for that matter.

My FAL is a pretty desireable STG58 from Steyr with a Type II upper which is also desireable - even still, I would let the FAL go before I got rid of my M1A

Ha Ha!!
This indeed
I have all three and I prefer my M1A's over the PTR or FAL.
All are great guns but M1A is THE gun for me.

[-hanko]

The Belgians make very nice chocolate and waffles and frites and lagers, but I have no first-hand experience with their skill at manufacturing things like weapons.

As was posted, FN makes and has made a ton of outstanding weapons.

google just a bit

[bsut]

The Belgians make very nice chocolate and waffles and frites and lagers, but I have no first-hand experience with their skill at manufacturing things like weapons.

...Now, any doubts about the Belgians' skill to manufacture weapons?

As was posted, FN makes and has made a ton of outstanding weapons. google just a bit

I have no doubt FN makes fine guns, but I have no first-hand experience with any Belgian-made or -designed precision machinery - only their delectable treats. I have lots of first-hand experience with German-made and -designed machinery, particularly their vehicles. I also have considerable first-hand experience with both Italian and Japanese machinery, and I would not select either of those sources (for different reasons) for this role either.

So when I had the choice between (civilian derivations of) 7.62 NATO battle rifles, I chose one with a German lineage. When we got it home and stripped it before its first day at the range, the expectation bore out: It has a very German feel to its mechanism, much like working on the BMW bikes and cars that are out in the garage. It's nothing at all like stripping a Beretta or working on the machinery I own or have owned from Campagnolo or Shimano or Mazda or Subaru or Chrysler or Ford. It's just a different feel and a different way of engineering.

Isn't it nice that everybody can make their own choices and spend their own money based on their own idiosyncratic criteria?

[-hanko]

some suggested reading for starters..

FN Herstal

FN HERSTAL - Firearms Tradition and Technological Innovation

John Browning

Browning Custom Shop

why yes indeed it is.. but leaving Belgium out of the OP topic is like leaving Winchester out of a discussion about lever actions.. yer just gonna have to take a little guff for it though..

I would also definitely recommend adding Stevens' FAL book to your reading...it's THE mama of all FAL books...http://www.amazon.com/FAL-Rifle-1-3-.../dp/0889351686

The FAL Files also has a ton of history on the FAL.

hth

-hanko

[omgwtfbbq]

I voted FAL. I will admit that I own neither but I have shot both. I prefer the ergonomics of the FAL to the PTR 91. The single piece lower receiver of the PTR it really limiting in terms of grip comfort.

Both are proven reliable platforms with decades of military service around the world so reliability isn't much of a selling point, although, I have heard much more ado about the G3 platform's reliability in the forum world.

As others have said, the PTR will beat up your brass pretty good so if you reload this might also give the edge to the FAL.

[SDPatriot]

JLD PTR-91 with (pinned?) retractable stock and a bunch of steel mags.