Stainless proned to galling, what does it mean?

[Barang]

I forget where I read this but it came to me last night and a little worried for my S&W 686 and some Sigs. I don't know if this is serious or not. So for those who own 1911 all stainless finish, Sig and S&W and others.... What's the consensus here?

[dreyna14]

Materials that are similar to each other can gall is rubbed together and start to develope burrs or other similar things. Since they are similar, they will literally weld together under pressure and you are not getting them apart. I usually encounter this with threaded fittings and stuff at work. That being said, protective oil or lubricant will pretty much ensure this won't happen. I wouldn't worry.

[ojisan]

Revolvers don't have the high-speed sliding / rubbing action of auto pistol slides, so it's not much of a concern for wheel guns.
Sigs and many other autos have alloy frames with stainless slides so you don't have similar metals rubbing on each other.
Early stainless autos (like a Smith 59) had the slides and frames made from the same stainless alloy, leading to galling if not well-lubricated.
Later all-stainless guns use different stainless alloys on frames and slides to reduce the chance of galling.

[Barang]

Thank you guys for the input. I was seriously thinking of having them coated with NP3 or other types. This info saves me money.
FYI: I have 2 Sigs that are all stainless (slide and frame), the rest are stainless slides and alloy frames.

[The Gleam]

I forget where I read this but it came to me last night and a little worried for my S&W 686 and some Sigs. I don't know if this is serious or not. So for those who own 1911 all stainless finish, Sig and S&W and others.... What's the consensus here?

Older semi-auto slides on stainless guns are the only serious worry, that is if you were a knucklehead and didn't keep your firearm lubed properly.

The stainless on stainless without proper lube, often led to one or both of the mating surfaces wearing against the other in a way that the surfaces are "pulled" apart, where if some of the microscopic metal dust/flakes/splinters seemingly can then weld/fuse/sinter to the other surface involved, making each rough, and increase friction against each other; and then the problem just gets worse with continued use.

Older/earlier stainless semi-auto guns were not carefully manufactured to have different hardness or alloy content between the mating surfaces, often using the same alloy-metal for both surfaces - so galling was more frequent (like AMTs and Randalls).

There used to be an old recommendation that before shooting a stainless frame/stainless slide gun, you should dunk it in gasoline and work the slide manually - a few hundred times or more - in that it would help to polish the mating surfaces in a way to prevent galling; then lube it up and you would likely never experience the problem. Others have told me that was just Urban-legend/wives tales, but the problem I have with discounting that advice is that it worked. I always noticed an incredible difference on my Detonics and Randall 1911s after I did this "gasoline" procedure and never had a problem with galling that I saw others have, even when they lubed their guns.

Years later, I started using Tetra Grease on those stainless guns and the problem became non-existant. Best lube I've found for prevent galling, the one that comes in a tube. Nothing works better on stainless slide guns in my experience.

[Peter.Steele]

Others have told me that was just Urban-legend/wives tales,

It's not a myth at all.

This is why fasteners tend to be spec'd with different stainless alloys for the nuts and bolts, if it's an application where you want to be able to take things apart afterwards. Alternative is to passivate and wax, and that makes the price of your stainless hardware go up, but it can make your supply chain easier to manage.

[The Gleam]

It's not a myth at all.

You misread me on that; I meant what some have said about the gasoline "treatment" for stainless guns I described. (I've now edited that to be a single paragraph).

[Peter.Steele]

You misread me on that; I meant what some have said about the gasoline "treatment" for stainless guns I described. (I've now edited that to be a single paragraph).

Ah, gotcha.

Yeah, the gasoline thing may be an urban legend, but similar SST alloys galling, that's absolutely 100% real. No myth there.

[meaty-btz]

Ah, gotcha.

Yeah, the gasoline thing may be an urban legend, but similar SST alloys galling, that's absolutely 100% real. No myth there.

And not just stainless but other metals can and will gall. All it takes is heat and pressure.

There is a reason we use anti-galling compounds on many bolts in engines.

[cruising7388]

The stainless on stainless without proper lube, often led to one or both of the mating surfaces wearing against the other in a way that the surfaces are "pulled" apart, where if some of the microscopic metal dust/flakes/splinters seemingly can then weld/fuse/sinter to the other surface involved, making each rough, and increase friction against each other; and then the problem just gets worse with continued use.

You've put your finger on a little appreciated phenomenon that doesn't arise with ferrous materials but can with stainless. It's particularly bad with threaded fasteners. If you incur some resistance threading a nut on a ferrous bolt it can often be "persuaded" and if this doesn't work you can still unthread the nut and start over again. Not so with stainless. With stainless it only takes relatively little resistance caused by a small mismatch in the nut and bolt threading to cause the nut and bolt to spontaneously weld to one another at which point you can't turn the nut in either direction. Prelubing helps somewhat but doesn't eliminate the risk. Bottom line is that if a stainless faster doesn not thread easily and smoothly from the get-go, back off while you still can.

This also applies to stainless slides and bodies although the risk of a weld while returning to battery is minimal. However, delaying stainless slide lubrication until the slide gets balky isn't a good idea because while lubing at that point frees up the slide action somewhat, it never seems to be as smooth as it was when it came out of the box.

[Barang]

Very interesting read, this additional info makes me more appreciative of greasing/lubrication. Thank you thankyou thank you all.

Now, one last question: Do you guys recommend thin coat or medium to heavy coat? I usually lubricate my guns medium to heavy so that when I function test them after cleaning, the oil runs. So I just wipe the excess off and ready for next range trip.

[Peter.Steele]

Now, one last question:[/COLOR] Do you guys recommend thin coat or medium to heavy coat? I usually lubricate my guns medium to heavy so that when I function test them after cleaning, the oil runs. So I just wipe the excess off and ready for next range trip.

There's plenty of different opinions on light / heavy / etc., but it really depends on the gun, and the conditions in which you shoot.

Garands, for instance, were designed around grease. By definition, grease is not a particularly light lubricant. AR's on the other hand, designed around a (relatively) light machine oil.

Heavy coats of oil, or heavy lubricants in general, will pick up more dust and grit than light coats, or light lubricants in general. Is that a problem? Well, if you're shooting out in the desert on BLM land, then yeah, probably. If you're shooting in an air conditioned indoor range, then probably it's less of an issue.

Myself, I run pretty much all my semiautos (AR's, 10/22's, Beretta 92FS) using Mobil 1 10W30, with a relatively light coat, because most of my shooting is in the desert. This reminds me though, I probably ought to strip and clean / oil the Beretta ... she's my carry gun, and probably has enough dust, lint and leather bits in her to be a problem by this point. It's been a while since she's been stripped and cleaned.

[Barang]

Wow! That Mobil oil caught me off guard. Here I am buying expensive lubricants when could have just bought motor oil instead. Can this oil be use for long term storage too say ... 1 year plus?
Me and Wifey go to outdoor range so, have to do light coat next time.

[ironhorse1]

I have a S&W 639 stainless semi auto 9MM, Purchased in the eighties and shot a lot with heavy loads.

I found that the frame was rather soft and mallable. I needed to keep a gun grease on the critical contact areas of the slide and barrel lugs to prevent galling and peening of the frame.

If it is all stainless be sure to use good lubrication.

This problem can also occur in revolvers. My 686, also purchased in the eighties,
locked up one day. The ratchet on the cylinder had galled the recoil shield raising some metal.

I stoned the area flat and have not had any further issues.

irh

[postal]

Very interesting read, this additional info makes me more appreciative of greasing/lubrication. Thank you thankyou thank you all.

Now, one last question: Do you guys recommend thin coat or medium to heavy coat? I usually lubricate my guns medium to heavy so that when I function test them after cleaning, the oil runs. So I just wipe the excess off and ready for next range trip.

I use grease on slides for all my autos regardless of material.

I use oil on about everything else.

A light coat of grease works just fine on the rails of the frame/slide including my sig stainless 1911.

Currently I use tetra gun grease, but wouldnt hesitate to use that tub of auto parts store 'moly' grease I have in the garage.....