Thinking about getting a FFL license, advice please

[smittty]

What does it take to get a FFL license? I'm in Santa Barbara. We have 2 gun shops in town and a third FFL who works part-time out of his house. There was a third gun hsop but they lost their license so there isn't much competition.

The guy who works part time out of his house charges $70 for a transaction plus background and check.

There might be an opportunity to work a couple evenings a week. Not keeping any inventory only ordering something after the customer has payed for it and keep in the safe for the waiting period.

Any advice and suggestions you have would be appreciated.

Thanks,
Smitty

[BigMac]

I would start by going to the CA DOJ website and look into whats required of you.

Also, you may want to look into a retail space. You'll be looking for one thats not too close to a school and willing to rent to a gunshop.

Youll need to look into insurance. If you really decide to do it give me a call and I wll help you find insurance.

You'll need funding. I started with very little money 80g.

After you have read the Fed and State requirements if you have more questions please feel free to ask.

[smittty]

The other guy in town does it this way and he's pretty busy. I would only do it from home and 2 nights a week by appointment only.

If the start-up costs are more than this idea/time commitment allows then it's not possible for me to get into.

Please keep the advice and suggestions coming.

I will look on the doj website for their requirements.

Thanks,
Smitty

[halifax]

Start locally. If you can't get past them, that's the end of it.

[Shane916]

The other guy in town does it this way and he's pretty busy. I would only do it from home and 2 nights a week by appointment only.

The general consensus around here is that the ATF will not issue any new FFL's to individuals who don't have a shop i.e retail store. Thus attempting to reduce the number of kitchen table dealers.

[Casual Observer]

The general consensus around here is that the ATF will not issue any new FFL's to individuals who don't have a shop i.e retail store. Thus attempting to reduce the number of kitchen table dealers.

^I've heard this from some ATF agents as well. They haven't approved an FFL for a home business in a few years and they're not going to change.

You can get a small retail space- like a single office or something and put your home down as an alternative storage site for the guns (although this would make your home open to the ATF for inspections- no warrants needed.)

That being said, you need to check with the local authorities. When the owners for J&J started looking for a location for our store, they got everything from "A gun store in our city? Sure.....but you'll pay every fee and buy every permit the city can think of.....plus maybe a few new ones just because..." all the way to "A gun store? In Irvine? You're joking right?"

Once you have a lead on a retail space, then you'll have to apply to the Feds, who will inspect your retail space floor to ceiling to make sure it has the proper security required, run a credit check on you, background check, etc. Then you have to do the same thing with CA DOJ. Once all that's done, you'll need to get on the Centralized List and get your CFL number. If you're going to sell handguns, you need to get your Handgun Safety Card account going as well with the state.

I don't mean to discourage you, but if you're only looking to do this 2-3 nights a week after work, I'd do a serious cost / benefit analysis.

[Librarian]

The other guy in town does it this way and he's pretty busy. I would only do it from home and 2 nights a week by appointment only.

If the start-up costs are more than this idea/time commitment allows then it's not possible for me to get into.

Please keep the advice and suggestions coming.

I will look on the doj website for their requirements.

Thanks,
Smitty

Start with PC 12071

12071. (a) (1) As used in this chapter, the term "licensee,"
"person licensed pursuant to Section 12071," or "dealer" means a
person who has all of the following:
(A) A valid federal firearms license.
(B) Any regulatory or business license, or licenses, required by
local government.
(C) A valid seller's permit issued by the State Board of
Equalization.
(D) A certificate of eligibility issued by the Department of
Justice pursuant to paragraph (4).
(E) A license issued in the format prescribed by paragraph (6).
(F) Is among those recorded in the centralized list specified in
subdivision (e).
(2) The duly constituted licensing authority of a city, county, or
a city and county shall accept applications for, and may grant
licenses permitting, licensees to sell firearms at retail within the
city, county, or city and county. The duly constituted licensing
authority shall inform applicants who are denied licenses of the
reasons for the denial in writing.
(3) No license shall be granted to any applicant who fails to
provide a copy of his or her valid federal firearms license, valid
seller's permit issued by the State Board of Equalization, and the
certificate of eligibility described in paragraph (4).
(4) A person may request a certificate of eligibility from the
Department of Justice and the Department of Justice shall issue a
certificate to an applicant if the department's records indicate that
the applicant is not a person who is prohibited from possessing
firearms.
(5) The department shall adopt regulations to administer the
certificate of eligibility program and shall recover the full costs
of administering the program by imposing fees assessed to applicants
who apply for those certificates.
(6) A license granted by the duly constituted licensing authority
of any city, county, or city and county, shall be valid for not more
than one year from the date of issuance and shall be in one of the
following forms:
(A) In the form prescribed by the Attorney General.
(B) A regulatory or business license that states on its face
"Valid for Retail Sales of Firearms" and is endorsed by the signature
of the issuing authority.
(C) A letter from the duly constituted licensing authority having
primary jurisdiction for the applicant's intended business location
stating that the jurisdiction does not require any form of regulatory
or business license or does not otherwise restrict or regulate the
sale of firearms.
(7) Local licensing authorities may assess fees to recover their
full costs of processing applications for licenses.

Your city or county should have an office or staff member who can help you with the requirements to start a business. For Santa Barbara, start here.

[Mssr. Eleganté]

If local laws allow you to run a gun business from your home then BATFE has to grant you an FFL, as long as everything else checks out.

BATFE can't just decide they don't want you to run a "kitchen table" gun business. They were able to shut down all of the home based FFL's by requiring them to follow local zoning and licensing rules and by raising the FFL licensing fee.

The big problem is finding a place in California that has no restrictions on home based firearms businesses. Out in the boonies there is no problem, but there are no customers either.

[OCArmory]

Here are the problems I am facing.
1) you must keep regular hours to be approved by the BATF.Some exceptions are made for gunsmiths.
2) It has taken me 3 months to find a retail space that will even rent to me. Most commercial property is run by a management company and the are a pain in the *** to get around.
3)I plan to be paying rent on my retail location for 6 months before all the permits and licenses are don. Sure i can sell holster and other stuff like tasers.

I don't mean to discourage you, If you have the desire go for it. Just me sure you understand the investment in both time and money before you jump head first. I am signing my lease tomorrow and it is the scariest think I have ever done. (Not really i just have a lot riding on this store.)

Good luck and if you have any questions hit me with a PM.
Mike

[CRTguns]

Take some advice from a guy who HAD an FFL, and a profitable gun boutique for @ 3 years...

DON'T!

[bigthaiboy]

Hi OCArmory / Mike,

Please keep us informed on your new store, as it's up and running. Where's your location? in the OC obviously?

[Moonclip]

I've dealt with the running of an indoor range before long ago, an FFL is even worse than that is some ways.

You know the old saying, want to start a small gun business? Buy a big one and wait. If you are serious then all power to you but this is a serious decision to make.

Many hobbiest gun people think it would be cool and their dream to own a gunshop and/or a range, it then becomes a nightmare sometimes when it is for profit and not for fun.

A fellow range manager/owner told me this once on THR. "all the customers have shooting as a hobby and expect you to run the business as a hobby too". It got old hearing "what do you mean it costs $10 to shoot all day, thats a ripoff!" Keeping in mind some ranges charge by the hour and such. I knew a range that would't allow anything but ammo they sold even in your own guns!

[Stanze]

Kiss your 4th amendment rights goodbye with the DOJ and ATF on your nutz 24/7.

I hate to admit it, but it's way more trouble than it's worth. Unless you've got a mountain of money(inventory is a tiny part of what it's going to cost) and time to burn, I wouldn't recommend it.

[BlackReef]

Kiss your 4th amendment rights goodbye with the DOJ and ATF on your nutz 24/7.

I hate to admit it, but it's way more trouble than it's worth. Unless you've got a mountain of money(inventory is a tiny part of what it's going to cost) and time to burn, I wouldn't recommend it.

wow....if everybody followed your advice, we would have no gun dealers in CA. Somebody's got to do it

[Moonclip]

wow....if everybody followed your advice, we would have no gun dealers in CA. Somebody's got to do it

True, but it's not something to jump in to unless you are wealthy with a lot of free time. Otherwise it needs to be researched carefully. I wonder what the going under to new ffl ratio
is in CA the last 10 years. 5 to 1? ARM USA opened in 1999 and they already moved to AZ like a year or two ago.

And went belly up? KPG of Anaheim, B&B,B&E,Lock,Stock,and Barrel Temple City, Flag guns of La Habra, Richs Arms in Whittier, Pony Express, Turners in Stanton(it's a Sizzler now),The Gunsight in Placentia,JR's range(they didn't sell guns last few years though),Matthews and Sons gunsmithing in Downey(in business over 50 years),Papac in Montebello,there is more but this is off the top of my head and just in LA and OC.