Hearing and Ear Damage

[ajl2121]

Hey all,

I just have a question regarding gunfire and the possible effects of hearing and ear damage. I have a 12 gauge and a .45, and when at the range w/ ear plugs on, I am fine. However, on a recent trip, someone was shooting what I believe was either a .357 or possibly a .44 out of a revolver. They were right next to me, and the noise was unbearable. I had to wear BOTH my ear plugs and my Howard Leight 30 db reducing ear muffs. I was ok then.

When SHTF or during HD, I wouldn't recommend using ear plugs or muffs due to the time it takes to equip oneself, and also because it would hinder my ability to use the critical sense of hearing in those situations. Does anyone have experience with firing guns with no hearing protection? If so, what caliber? Should I be concerned with hearing and ear damage from my USP .45F (JHP) or my mossberg 500 (buckshots) w/o protection?

Recently, on a trip to walmart, I saw some winchester 12 gauge loads that said they were reduced noise...Probably the same as reduced recoil, I'd imagine, and it got me thinking.

[762cavalier]

Without hearing protection even a .22 will cause hearing damage. In a self defense scenario where you are protecting your life or others hearing damage is the least of your worries

[Crazyhorse]

While hunting I have shoot a ton of rifles and pistols including a few .44 some in short barrel, I like to hear the game so I don't use ears.. They aren't that bad outside but every shoot damages your hearing some. In side even doubled up it's hard and I try not to shoot my 4" redhawk with others in the range. I have had a few cases where I had very minor hearing issues for a few days after hunting. But like Cavalier said life or hearing?

[Rust]

Prolonged exposure to anything over 85db will cause hearing loss. As will continued momentary exposure to higher levels such as gun fire. OSHA wants you to to have hearing protection that would bring you back down below 85 at all times. So if the guy next to you is producing 130db with his gun you should have 30db reduction from you muffs, and at least 15db from plugs. Most decent plugs will range from 20-32db reduction. Few shooters actually double up, but technically you should since gunshots can produce 160db or more.
In a home defense situation the damage from a few shots is far outweighed by the damage that could be done while you're rolling up your earplugs.

[ColdSteel]

I envy your hearing abilities...
I shoot the .50 all day with just the stuff in type plugs.
No flinching, no pain.

[CSDGuy]

I double up my hearing protection whenever possible.

[bridgeport]

What?

[Slowshooter]

This is copy and paste from SIGforum post sometime ago.

Originally posted by pinnedandrecessed:
Facts on noise levels: http://www.healthsystem.virginia.edu...aring-loss.cfm Comparative noise levels and corresponding damage

12 gauge shotgun 165 dB Instant damage
Jet engine taking off 140 dB Instant damage
Thunder/Ambulance siren 119 dB 3 minutes
Hammer drill 113 dB 15 minutes
Chain saw/Earphones/Concert 110 dB 30 minutes
Bull Dozer 105 dB 1 hour
Tractor/Power tools 96 dB 4 hour
Hairdryer/lawnmower 90 dB 8 hours



Here are some examples of noise levels:

Video arcades - (110 dB).

Firecrackers - (125-155 dB at a distance of 10 feet).

Live music concerts - (120 dB and above).

Movie theatres - (118 dB).

Health clubs and aerobic studios (120 dB).

Sporting events (127 dB).

Motorboats - (85-115 dB).

Motorcycles - (95-120 dB).

Snowmobiles - (99 dB).

"Boom cars" - (140 dB and above).

Here are noise levels of firearms:

.223, 55GR. Commercial load 18" barrel 155.5dB

.243 in 22" barrel 155.9dB

.30-30 in 20" barrel 156.0dB.

7mm Magnum in 20" barrel 157.5dB.

.308 in 24" barrel 156.2dB.

.30-06 in 24" barrel 158.5dB. In 18" barrel 163.2dB.

.375 18" barrel with muzzle brake 170 dB.

.410 Bore 28" barrel 150dB. 26" barrel 150.25dB. 18" barrel 156.30dB.

20 Gauge 28" barrel 152.50dB. 22" barrel 154.75dB.

12 Gauge 28" barrel 151.50dB. 26" barrel 156.10dB. 18" barrel 161.50dB.

.25 ACP 155.0 dB.

.32 LONG 152.4 dB.

.32 ACP 153.5 dB.

.380 157.7 dB.

9mm 159.8 dB.

.38 S&W 153.5 dB.

.38 Spl 156.3 dB.

.357 Magnum 164.3 dB.

.41 Magnum 163.2 dB.

.44 Spl 155.9 dB.

.45 ACP 157.0 dB.

.45 COLT 154.7 dB.

Factoid

Properly fitted earplugs or muffs reduce noise 15 to 30 dB. The better earplugs and muffs are approximately equal in sound reductions, although earplugs are better for low frequency noise and earmuffs for high frequency noise.

All of us should be trying to get the greatest Noise Reduction Rating (NRR) that can be put together. NRR 30 plugs with NRR 20 muffs will give you an effective NRR 45 (add plugs and muffs, then subtract 5). If noise levels are 160 dB this gives you an exposure with plugs and muffs of 115 dB. The acceptable exposure time for this is 15 minutes total for the day. If the noise levels are 150 dB the resultant acceptable exposure time with the given plugs and muffs is 1 hour and 4 hours if the noise level is 140 dB. You're not going to find unsuppressed noise levels below 140dB with gunfire.

(Note: some question the credibility of the above formula. They say instead you take the higher of the two and add 5 dB to that. 30 plug with 20 muff gives an effective NRR of 35 not 45.)

If you are shooting by yourself, roughly 100 rounds of 140 dB instantaneous noise in a day should not produce hearing damage. Put your plugs and muffs on and you get to shoot up to a thousand rounds without damage (louder ammo/gun and the allowable drops by a factor of 5). Shoot with other people and you have to add all the rounds shot cumulatively (10 people shoot 100 rounds and everybody's done for the day; toss a handcannon or 30 cal rifle in and you're back down to 200 rounds cumulative). If you shoot on an indoor range then all the rounds fired while you are on the range go into your total. So you can see that it doesn't take very long on a range to have a thousand rounds popped off around you.

If you want to know what the noise level you are exposed to is you can rent noise dosimeters that you can wear. They will record the total noise exposure and present the information to you as dB. You can then subtract the adjusted combined NRR of your hearing protection to determine if you're getting too much exposure.

LINKS

http://www.deafnessresearch.org.uk/N...+loss+1640.twl

http://www.healthsystem.virginia.edu...aring-loss.cfm
http://www.audiologyawareness.com/library.asp

Double up if you can. Invest money. I'm using ear plugs + Sordins. Works well indoors too.

[tophatjones]

Does anyone know which specific combination of plugs and ear muffs provide the best hearing protection?

[Guns R Tools]

I guess for home defense you can get electronic ear muffs. Many will amplify low sounds as well. Plus in my book. You can hear low rustling sounds very well with electronic ear muffs.

[Kestryll]

I repost this every time the hearing issue comes up since I live with the results every day. It's my pet cause on the sports side of shooting.

Repost:
This is an important issue for shooters, hearing NEVER comes back.

Due to some unprotected outdoor shooting, industrial noises from various shops I visited as part of my job back when, indoor raquetball and having the occasion to discharge a .357 in my livingroom I have had low level ringing for several years now.
I recently went shooting with a friend outdoors with cheap pharmacy-style earplugs and got more battered. After a few days of "Huh?" my Wife insisted that I go to an audiologist.
The results are "substantial and signifigant hearing loss in the left ear and signifigant loss in the right." and a recommendation to get a hearing aid for the left. It won't fix the hearing, nothing can, but it may help with clarity. I missed a good portion of the 'spoken word' test. I heard the noise but misinterpreted the words leading to answering questions on an entirely different subject!

The end result of all of this is that at age 38 I have lost the upper register on the right side, most of the upper register and ALL of the mid-range on the left and will be wearing a hearing aid to keep up with conversations.

Wear those plugs and muffs! Wear both!
And pay attention to the other loud noises in your life. I had no idea that indoor raquetball was the aucoustic equivilent of repeated gunshots!

Hearing damage is nerve damage and guess which part of the body cannot grow back...

Unfortunately it is a common mistake that auditory exclusion acts to prevent hearing loss. It does not. I never heard the .357 gunshot in my living room that took most of the hearing in my left ear. Oddly I did hear the glass of the patio door break however.

Auditory exclusion is an aspect of the mind filtering out data it considers to be unnecessary to your immediate survival. You will not 'hear' things that are not directly associated with the 'threat' whatever that is. The sound, and more importantly the shockwave, still exist and still do damage you are just not aware of it on a conscious level.
Auditory exclusion has no physical mechanism for protecting the eardrum and inner ear bones, it is solely a mental filter.

In this it is the same as the tunnel vision people often report in a shooting or high stress event. "All I saw was the gun and his face as he aimed at me!" is often heard. Again the rest of the world is still there but the mind does not consider the cat on the wall to your left to be immediately pertinent to your survival so you don't 'see' it. Tunnel vision is just another 'filter' to keep you focused on staying alive.

[fleegman]

I remember a news story from years ago about a woman who shot a home-invader in her hallway with her 12 gauge; she ended up mostly deaf in one ear, and partially deaf in the other, but alive. Made me realize just how loud a firearm is when discharged in the confines of a typical house, and the consequences to your hearing. It ain't like in the movies.

My entire HD strategy is too complicated to relate here, but on my bedside table is my XD40, my surefire, and my proears, which I am experimenting with retrofitting with a vox/comm system designed for motorcyclists. My daughter has the same setup in her room (the proears, that is). That way, besides offering protection from gunfire and amplifying ambient sounds (a HUGE tactical advantage), we could also talk to each other from different areas of the house, even in whispers. And yes, thanks to my other HD precautions, we will have the time to put the things on if a break-in occurs (assuming we are in our bedrooms), unless the bad-guys use 20' ladders, or we are otherwise invaded by ninjas coming through our second-story windows.

[MrBurns]

This is all really good stuff guys. I'm glad I read this thread. I usually just wear plugs when I'm at the range, but last time I went out, it was very busy (at Angeles) and even after stepping away three different times to reinsert my plugs they just didn't seem as effective as usual. I went home three hours later with my left ear ringing like crazy and along with the ringing there was a weird sound like a slide whistle. It was driving me nuts and took the rest of the night for it to go away. I'm gonna take that experience as a warning and get some muffs to go along with the plugs. Oddly enough, its .223 and .40SW that bug my left ear the most.

ETA: My mom has her masters in speech pathology and worked with the deaf and brain damaged her whole career. You'd think I'd have known to use plugs and muffs from the start.

[ajl2121]

Very good stuff...I remember a few years back in high school, I would go to parties with huge speakers that you could literally sit inside of. My friends and I would communicate by screaming in each others' ears, but could hardly hear one another. I always pondered the idea why it hurts when they scream w/o the music on, but its ok when the music was on. My ears would ring for the next day. The sound competitions with my subwoofers in the back of my car couldn't have been good for my ears either. 4 class D monoblock amplifiers supplying 1000 continuous watts to 4 12" Kicker solobarick L7's were pretty loud...It would sometimes get difficult to breathe in the car. Luckily for the comps, you don't have to sit inside.

So hopefully, if someone breaks into my home, I won't have to shoot them...It will save my hearing, and the value of my house won't depreciate.

[ByTheNumbers]

I went home three hours later with my left ear ringing like crazy and along with the ringing there was a weird sound like a slide whistle. It was driving me nuts...

I think few people really appreciate how life changing hearing related damage, like tinnitus or "ringing" in the ears, can be unless they have experienced it themselves. It really can drive a person crazy.

Obviously, if you're in a situation where it's your life or the BG's life, hearing damage is not the #1 priority, but it sucks that hearing damage is yet another permanent consequence of having to use a firearm even once, besides the psychological, legal, financial, etc. consequences.