PPT from within CA, but no FTF.

[Mickael81]

I am purchasing a long gun from another Calgunner that lives in NorCal. Since I live in Riverside county (Murrieta), my plan was to have him mail the rifle to my local gun shop.

The first gun shop (The Shootist) that I went to told me that they will charge me $25 for dros and $70 for the transfer ($95). To make things worse, they told me that although the firearm is a in-state ppt, they have to charge me state taxes and the transfer has to come from an ffl .... wth? So my $730 rifle would end up costing me about $880.

The second gun shop (Steelwater Firearms) told me the same story. The seller cannot ship the rifle directly to them, but instead the seller has to see an ffl, and have his ffl ship it to them. $25 for dros, $55 for transfer, and %8 state tax....

The third choice was my co-worker's friend that has a full time job and works as an ffl on this spare time. He told me that although it is prefered that a ppt is done from an ffl to ffl, there are no laws prohibiting the seller from shipping the rifle directly to the buyers ffl. He mentioned that as long as the seller contacts him and the rifle is CA compliant, it was all kosher.
The best part,... $25 for dros, $10 transfer fee.

Needless to say, I went with my third option. It's sad that my local gun store was out to screw me when I have been a loyal customer for years. I probably spent over 3K at The Shootist in the past few years...

The lesson here is to keep up on your stuff and avoid being taken advantage of.

p.s. the ffl that I am using from now on is: Tactical Impressions & Arms. scottdeleers@yahoo.com

[kel-tec-innovations]

Second gun shop FUD, the seller can ship directly to your FFL with a copy of drivers license.

Have the seller write an invoice for $50 or $100 so you get taxed at $50 or $100. I did a gift one time and some gun shops don't let that fly and charge at MSRP.

[redcliff]

Per the California DOJ, for it to be a PPT both parties must physically appear at the transferring FFL. Your transaction was not a PPT. Therefore the transferring dealer can legally charge whatever they want to receive and log in the firearm in their book. Many FFL's don't accept firearms from non-FFL's due to concerns over the true identity of the seller.

I do not believe the dealer should charge sales tax on transfers unless the firearm he's transferring was received from out of state OR unless he was involved in procurring the buyer or negotiating the price. This is why you pay sales tax on a consignment purchase (a type of PPT) but not on a normal PPT.

[Mickael81]

Per the California DOJ, for it to be a PPT both parties must physically appear at the transferring FFL. Your transaction was not a PPT. Therefore the transferring dealer can legally charge whatever they want to receive and log in the firearm in their book. Many FFL's don't accept firearms from non-FFL's due to concerns over the true identity of the seller.

So... in my case, what kind of transfer would you say it is? We are not doing a FTF but it is still a PPT right? Don't know for sure what to call it. I still think the gun shops in Murrieta are charging way too much specially since I have been a long time customer. It's not like I have never purchased a firearm through them before and was using them just for transfers.

[geeknow]

When both parties are NOT present, there is no ppt. It becomes a dealer transfer. Your "buddy the ffl" is not correct.

[mrdd]

CHAPTER 5. Procedure For a Private Party Firearms Transaction [28050. - 28070.] ( Chapter 5 added by Stats. 2010, Ch. 711, Sec. 6. )
28050. (a) A person shall complete any sale, loan, or transfer of a firearm through a person licensed pursuant to Sections 26700 to 26915, inclusive, in accordance with this chapter in order to comply with Section 27545.

(b) The seller or transferor or the person loaning the firearm shall deliver the firearm to the dealer who shall retain possession of that firearm.

(c) The dealer shall then deliver the firearm to the purchaser or transferee or the person being loaned the firearm, if it is not prohibited, in accordance with Section 27540.

(d) If the dealer cannot legally deliver the firearm to the purchaser or transferee or the person being loaned the firearm, the dealer shall forthwith, without waiting for the conclusion of the waiting period described in Sections 26815 and 27540, return the firearm to the transferor or seller or the person loaning the firearm. The dealer shall not return the firearm to the seller or transferor or the person loaning the firearm when to do so would constitute a violation of Section 27500, 27505, 27515, 27520, 27525, 27530, or 27535. If the dealer cannot legally return the firearm to the transferor or seller or the person loaning the firearm, then the dealer shall forthwith deliver the firearm to the sheriff of the county or the chief of police or other head of a municipal police department of any city or city and county, who shall then dispose of the firearm in the manner provided by Sections 18000, 18005, and 34000.

The phrase "shall deliver" is likely interpreted as meaning "in person".

[dieselpower]

This is the same as buying a gun online from another state. Its not a Federal law that the firearm be shipped from an FFL, but some States do require that. California doesnt.

Every shop sets their own rules and prices... thats what our country was founded on...a free market. You did what buyers do in a free market...look for the deal that suits you best.

There is nothing wrong with the gun shops. They are doing what they do...charge people a fee for their services.

The sale price is $0.01 as far as the FFL is concerned. So let him charge tax on that.

[9mmepiphany]

Both shops were being completely above board...they just have to charge more for the transfer than the kitchen table FFL because of their overhead.

What they charge isn't regulated and they can charge what the market will bear...only a PPT/FTF (they are the same thing) is limited to $35 by law. $70 is a bit high, $55 is pretty common...I've seen normal fees up to $100 + DROS...most kitchen table FFLs I've checked with charge $35 ($60 total)

There is no such thing as a PPT when you have to mail the gun...unless you count intra family ones