Mother Jones: Guns are the problem

[strongpoint]

More Guns, More Mass Shootings -- Coincidence?
America now has 300 million firearms, a barrage of NRA-backed gun laws -- and record casualties from mass killers.

In the fierce debate that always follows the latest mass shooting, it's an argument you hear frequently from gun rights promoters: If only more people were armed, there would be a better chance of stopping these terrible events. This has plausibility problems -- what are the odds that, say, a moviegoer with a pack of Twizzlers in one pocket and a Glock in the other would be mentally prepared, properly positioned, and skilled enough to take out a body-armored assailant in a smoke- and panic-filled theater? But whether you believe that would happen is ultimately a matter of theory and speculation. Instead, let's look at some facts gathered in a two-month investigation by Mother Jones.

no surprise, considering the source; full story here. i would appreciate it (for internet argument purposes) if CGN would collectively poke a bunch of holes in this thing.

[5thgen4runner]

I'm getting sick of hearing this crap that ltcers are not skilled enough, blah blah blah.

I wanna know real data that shows how many rounds or how much training cops put through their carry guns vs. Us In a year. I bet we put the same, If not more practice with ours.

I don't know, but that exuse like every other is getting old.

[chozenfew805]

[ClarenceBoddicker]

One advantage that CCW citizens have is that they are not shielded by qualified immunity, as LEOs are. The CCW person is personally responsible for every round they fire. There is far less "friendly fire" incidents from CCW shooters, compared to LEOs.

An anti gun person can't fathom the mental preperdness that comes with carrying a firearm & practicing realistly to use it correctly. Even hits on body armor may have cause to Dark Night shooter to be less effictive. There is 3 simple choices:

1) Zero safety in gun free (I'm still looking for where to get the free guns at, as the signs don't tell me where to pick them up at) prohibition zones.

2) Limited safety by "on call" LEOs. Bad guy shoots, you call for your safety to arrive. "When seconds count, the Police are only minutes away."

3) Full safety by CCW. Taking personal responsibility for your individual safety by CCWing, is a far better option & less damaging to the Constitution and taxpayers. Why pay for help, when you can get it done for free?

I purposely omitted the 4th option, which is the dream of FOP/union. That would be a massive expansion of the US Police State. They would have a few LEOs stationed in the theater lobby & one LEO posted at each row's aisle seat. The lobby officers would do the ID/warrant checks and a pat down search, then body scanners. This soon to be reality option would cost a bit more in taxes & drive up prices. Anything is OK, as long as I feel safe....

[dieselpower]

its a common anti-gun theme...with failed logic at its core. Recently a husband shot and killed his wife thinking she was an intruder... that means every husband is going to shoot his wife...

[Capybara]

If I am not mistaken, it came out later that the Aurora shooter was NOT wearing any bullet proof armor, just tacticool looking wardrobe. So anyone who could have gotten a clean, center mass shot off could have saved lives.

[FalconLair]

i started to read the article until I realized that i dont even know who this Mother Jones is, so how could I possibly care what she says

[ja308]

Mary Harris "Mother" Jones (1837 – November 30, 1930) was an Irish schoolteacher and dressmaker who became a prominent labor and community organizer !

hahahahahah bet her dresses did not sell !

[DarkSoul]

If I am not mistaken, it came out later that the Aurora shooter was NOT wearing any bullet proof armor, just tacticool looking wardrobe. So anyone who could have gotten a clean, center mass shot off could have saved lives.

True, it was indicated that he was not wearing armor, just a black chest rig/vest.

And I agree with you except for one small exception in that, probably even an extremity shot or gut, hell, any hit probably would have stopped him. Most of these guys are cowards, and as soon as opposing force is seen, they tuck tail and run, or off themselves right there, probably even soone firing into the ceiling would have been enough.

[ECG_88]

Any LEOs or Military here been shot with a vest on? I heard it still hurts like hell, knocks the wind out of you and possibly breaks ribs? Is that not a combat effective hit?

[SilverTauron]

If I am not mistaken, it came out later that the Aurora shooter was NOT wearing any bullet proof armor, just tacticool looking wardrobe. So anyone who could have gotten a clean, center mass shot off could have saved lives.

The anti-gun media's focus on "The Vest" is a red herring.

Body armor isn't indefinitely bulletproof; it can stop only so many impacts before it loses effectiveness entirely. The vest may stop the 1st COM shot, and perhaps the 2nd-but following hits have a greater chance to penetrate especially at close range. Even if the guy's armored up like Emil Mataseranu, a headshot from 7 yards is definitely viable. One witness said she was looking at the guy's face as he shot into the crowd.At that distance, im certain any of us could have put down Holmes without breaking a sweat.Anything would be better than people being slaughtered, but the media finds this fact incompatible with its MO.

Another note-most movie theatres aren't as big as you'd assumed on careful inspection.After the Colorado incident I took careful note of the size of the movie cineplex's and found out some of them aren't even 50 feet long. They *look* huge because its dark and you're sitting in a seat the entire time.

[CDFingers]

Criminals don't obey laws, so calls for more laws affect only the law abiding.

The article is weak because it relies on the premise that laws will stop crime. Moreover, it uses statistics falsely by not properly breaking down "gun deaths" into suicides, homicides among gang members, and homicides made while doing other crimes. Broken down that way, it is clear that guns are not the problem. Criminals are the problem.

CDFingers

[ewarmour]

It's Mother Jones. If the Mother Jones types had their way we would be living in a "communist utopia".

[CBlacksheep]

The comments are even worse than the article.

[wjc]

Mother Jones == liberal pinko rag.

Not even worth lining a bird cage. I save that honor for the San Jose Murky News.