CA ammo, non lead.

[Mike's Custom]

well, I just got back from the Shot Show. Not much to report about lead free bullets. Barnes and Nosler are the oly ones making anything at all and it is limited. I talked to CCI about rimfire ammo and they have a .22 Magnum bullet that will have a POLYCARBONET tip. It will be much like the Hornady plastic tip bullet but the P/C tip is harder so it will expand the harder bronze bullet. HTey had some test shot bullets that look very good in the expansion and ballistic gel test. The .22LR and .17 HMR and MACH2 are being designed now but have not reached the testing stages from what I was told. They did say the .17 will most likely be in the 20 grain bullets. Hornady and Nosler and Federal are NOT planning to build any non lead bullets at this time. Hornady said they may do somehting for 1009 depending on the demand. Arizona, from what I have heard at the Shot Show is also trying to ban lead in their condor range so that may help push the bullet makers to get going. No matter what, look for HUGE price increases in ammo for CA rimfire shooting.

If anyone else found out any information at the Shot Show that I missed please post it here.

[Rob P.]

well, I just got back from the Shot Show. Not much to report about lead free bullets. Barnes and Nosler are the oly ones making anything at all and it is limited. I talked to CCI about rimfire ammo and they have a .22 Magnum bullet that will have a POLYCARBONET tip. It will be much like the Hornady plastic tip bullet but the P/C tip is harder so it will expand the harder bronze bullet. HTey had some test shot bullets that look very good in the expansion and ballistic gel test. The .22LR and .17 HMR and MACH2 are being designed now but have not reached the testing stages from what I was told. They did say the .17 will most likely be in the 20 grain bullets. Hornady and Nosler and Federal are NOT planning to build any non lead bullets at this time. Hornady said they may do somehting for 1009 depending on the demand. Arizona, from what I have heard at the Shot Show is also trying to ban lead in their condor range so that may help push the bullet makers to get going. No matter what, look for HUGE price increases in ammo for CA rimfire shooting.

If anyone else found out any information at the Shot Show that I missed please post it here.

If the bullets are truly bronze I would suggest that you not consider buying them. Bronze bullets would be seriously illegal.

More likely they are copper.

[emc002]

If the bullets are truly bronze I would suggest that you not consider buying them. Bronze bullets would be seriously illegal.

Ok, dumb question, why would bronze be illegal?

[ke6guj]

Ok, dumb question, why would bronze be illegal?

The definition of ap ammo is at 18 USC 921(a)(17):
"(B) The term `armor piercing ammunition' means-

(i) a projectile or projectile core which may be used in a handgun and
which is constructed entirely (excluding the presence of traces of other
substances) from one or a combination of tungsten alloys, steel, iron, brass,
bronze, beryllium copper, or depleted uranium; or

[What Just Happened?]

Wait, isn't wolf ammo steel core?

[ke6guj]

Wait, isn't wolf ammo steel core?

not in 7.62x39. It may be steel jacketed but not steel core. The reason is that there are pistols that can shoot 7.62x39 so all steel cored ammo got ruled AP

[JeffM]

You forgot to bold one of those parts:

The definition of ap ammo is at 18 USC 921(a)(17):
"(B) The term `armor piercing ammunition' means-

(i) a projectile or projectile core which may be used in a handgun and
which is constructed entirely (excluding the presence of traces of other
substances) from one or a combination of tungsten alloys, steel, iron, brass,
bronze, beryllium copper, or depleted uranium; ...

This bullet is also partly made of polycarbonate.

[Conversekidz]

You forgot to bold one of those parts:

The definition of ap ammo is at 18 USC 921(a)(17):
"(B) The term `armor piercing ammunition' means-

(i) a projectile or projectile core which may be used in a handgun and
which is constructed entirely (excluding the presence of traces of other
substances) from one or a combination of tungsten alloys, steel, iron, brass,
bronze, beryllium copper, or depleted uranium; ...

This bullet is also partly made of polycarbonate.

I'm sorry but what is the piece called that is covered by polycarbonate.....its the core.

If you are going to post something and spend the time highlight a point, please make sure you read whole of the law, not just the part to support your case.

[Mike's Custom]

I'm sorry but what is the piece called that is covered by polycarbonate.....its the core.

Reply: The core is not polycarbonet any more then the Hornady Ballistic tip is. The bullet is a hollow point that has the ballistic tip inserted to aid in the BC of the bullet and in aerodynamics and to help with the expansion when the small, light weight bullet hits soft tissue. Using a bronze or alloy that is harder then lead they needed a harder tip material to aid in the expansion. The plastic tip in their existing ballistic tipped bullets would not work so they are using the harder polycarbonet to help with the expansion. But, it is part of the bullet so it would not be solid bronze.

If you are going to post something and spend the time highlight a point, please make sure you read whole of the law, not just the part to support your case.

Hornady would not discuss the exact process and when I told them my theories as to their design they just smiled and nodded. There are several things that can be added to bronze, like tin that will allow better expansion. All they would say is it is solid bronze but bronze is made up of different compounds. I don't care what they make them out of as long as I can shoot them and worry about lead.

[bohoki]

I'm sorry but what is the piece called that is covered by polycarbonate.....its the core.

If you are going to post something and spend the time highlight a point, please make sure you read whole of the law, not just the part to support your case.

doesnt the polycarbonite tip extend into a hollow point cavity becoming part of the core

[JeffM]

doesnt the polycarbonite tip extend into a hollow point cavity becoming part of the core

That is what I was thinking.