Really need some help with AW transfer questions

[stevenjay1]

I have a friend who passed away and left several assault weapons to his daughter. They are registered as assault weapons with the state of California and now legally transferred to her. She would like to sell them and asked me for help. Here are the questions:

1. Can she sell these as a PPT and what paperwork would be required?

2. Can she sell these via an auction site like Gunbroker and have the guns shipped from a CA 01FFL to another CA 01FFL or an out of state 01 FFL?

3. Does anyone know of a shop or 01FFL in the San Francisco Bay Area that would handle the AW transfer? Everyone I’ve spoken to are afraid to deal with AW’s due to the fact they are unsure what the laws are.

4. Is it even legal to sell a Registered Assault weapon in the state of CA or to sell it out of state?

The conversations with the DOJ have been confusing at best as every person that she speaks to gives a different answer. I appreciate any help we can get. Thanks

[QuarterBoreGunner]

They are registered as assault weapons with the state of California and now legally transferred to her.

Well here's my first question...

[cannon]

His daughter can't have them or sell them in California. While probate may give them to her the state won't. Kinda of a catch 22.

The receiver is the "bad" part. Depending on the type the old receiver can be removed and destroyed and replaced with a non listed one and sold normally.

I don't know the logistics of selling them out of state.

[stevenjay1]

The weapons are legally transfer to her, The DOJ approved the paperwork and took her money. Unless I have been misinformed can't the child of the original owner (in this case her father) legally have the weapons transfered to them? Sorry for the questions, I'm just trying to help her out.

[radiomanyt]

I don't think there is any "California legal" way to transfer the ownership to her (or anyone else for that matter), before or after his passing, regardless of what his will states.

I'm trying to be positive, but I suspect that his passing means the state is now the legal owner of those RAW's, and any attempt on her part to even transport it out of the state would be a felony.

I could be wrong, but I think the CA DOJ website states it pretty clearly, and he agreed to those terms when he completed the registration.

[Diesel-Gunner]

So if I am to understand you guys correctly, every AW in CA is non transferable to anyone after the original owner dies. So therefore CA has successfully managed to rid the state of AW's after the next 85 years or so after all of the original owners pass away?

Wow, they really did disarm the state from AW's... at least in the future or am I mis-understanding.

[stevenjay1]

Let me pose another question. There is a wife/step mother thought he was seperated but not divorced from her. I'm thinking I may not be getting the whole story here and I'll make a phone call in the morning to get it figured out. His daughter and the would have been Ex are on good terms, could his wife have legal ownership of the weapons? I may have not got the whole story....I think I'll call now!

[fire65]

Best thing for her to do is to go out and get as many off the list lower reciver as she need to replaced them and have the other one destroyed. Also explain to her that she needs to have the bullet button installed on the new lower recivers when she transfer the upper from her Dad complete rifels over. That way rest of the parts one the AW can still be kept, Just the lower need to be changed out. afater all this is done the gun will be her and DOJ can have the AW lower or any PD she just have to surrender them to them with proof that they were her Dads and that he passed away . This is the form she need to fill out with the lower reciver she turning in

http://oag.ca.gov/sites/all/files/pdfs/firearms/forms/BOF4546NLIP0209.pdf?

[Librarian]

So if I am to understand you guys correctly, every AW in CA is non transferable to anyone after the original owner dies. So therefore CA has successfully managed to rid the state of AW's after the next 85 years or so after all of the original owners pass away?

Wow, they really did disarm the state from AW's... at least in the future or am I mis-understanding.

Yes, as the law is today, that is correct. PC 30915:

Any person who obtains title to an assault weapon registered
under this article or that was possessed pursuant to subdivision (a)
of Section 30630 by bequest or intestate succession shall, within 90
days, do one or more of the following:
(a) Render the weapon permanently inoperable.
(b) Sell the weapon to a licensed gun dealer.
(c) Obtain a permit from the Department of Justice in the same
manner as specified in Article 3 (commencing with Section 32650) of
Chapter 6.
(d) Remove the weapon from this state.

[fire65]

Yes the wife has first dibs unless there was a wil,l but either way what I said above is the only way to get the guns kept in the familey upper at least if not State take them and no one wins but the State. the OLL will be registered in the Mom or daughter name when they go and get them , all there doing is replaceing the upper off Dad AW and putting it on the OLL with the bullet button attached to them , ? are the AW total lenght more the 30 inches, End of barrel to end of butt plate ,If not that another headache for them both but easy fix just buy longer barrlel.

[CSACANNONEER]

The weapons are legally transfer to her, The DOJ approved the paperwork and took her money. Unless I have been misinformed can't the child of the original owner (in this case her father) legally have the weapons transfered to them? Sorry for the questions, I'm just trying to help her out.

Yes, you have been misinformed. If DOJ really transfered the registration into her name, they broke the law and so did she. I would suggest contacting a good firearms attorney if this happened. Contact the CGF for a few suggestions on which attorney(s) to use.

[George W]

The only way either the wife or daughter could legally own them and keep them in the state of California is if they were named as a co owner on the original AW registration forms back in 89 , or SB-23 in 2000.
If they were then they can legally take possesion of them and keep them as is.
Should they want to sell them they have to be sold through an AW dealer not any old FFL dealer to an out of state FFL and send a letter to the CADOJ stating they are no longer in the state. They could also as mentioned dissasemble them and destroy the reciever and sell the parts or add the parts to a new OLL and configure it to meet the new regulations. Depending on what they are and when they were registered.
If they are on the list by name then they can't be sold to anyone in the state or reconfigured and stay here .
If they became an AW based off SB23 then they could be reconfigured to stay here.
They can not transfer them to any family member in the state from this point forward.

[stevenjay1]

Well, I just got off the phone and the mess is a little clearer. OK, this is what I was told:

1. The weapons are/were registered to both as Al and his wife were both shooters. George, you hit the nail on the head. So everything is still legal.
2. Two of the AW's WERE left in Al's will to his daughter and she wants to sell them. Step mom is OK with this or so I'm told.
3. Daughter is not sure about what "Paperwork and fees" her stepmother mentioned pertained too but maybe it was to take Al’s name off the registration. Again, only speculation on my part.
4. Every time I try to help I remember why I shouldn't!!

OK, now with some of this cleared up, what is the best way for the stepmother to sell the two AW's that were willed to said daughter so daughter can get the money.

[BKinzey]

A "Registered Assault Weapon", "RAW" is a legal term in CA for specific types of firearms. The terms are often tossed about. They may be mistaken as to what they actually have.

A RAW cannot be transferred. If it is determined these are indeed RAWs and DOJ did transfer them, THEY NEED TO CONTACT A LAWYER. There are several they can contact recommended by CGF.

I've attached an example of the letter the DOJ sends out for RAWs.

As for co-ownership or co-registration that is only good so long as both parties reside together. So if the daughter moved out, it's no longer good.

[BKinzey]

To further this mess

You might want to check each lower's manufacturer and model. There are a few manufacturers who's lowers aren't actually listed so if you bring the firearm into current compliance the mother can de-register it as a RAW.

Of course if the daughter just wants the money the wife (joint registrant) should sell them. Should be a lot less hassle.