OLL, DPMS, etc.

[rjeusmc]

I am new to the forum and understand this has been debated and covered in other forums, but think there is some confusion, and I need clarification.

I hail from Minnesota, not too far from the DPMS factory and have owned several DPMS rifles in my home state. I would also like to say I am appreciative to the members of this site for the opportunity to further my education in regards to CA legal firearms.

"DPMS: Panther (all)"

People have mentioned that a Lower stamped with the word "panther" or even the panther logo could be considered an AW under the law, and I do not read this anywhere in the law. When I look at that line under the 2nd Category, I see Manufaturer:Model(s). Do people not realize the "panther" rifles were ACTUAL MODELS, i.e. "Panther Lite", "Panther Lite 16" etc.???

An "A-15" is not specified under this list. I have NEVER seen an A-15 without the "DPMS PANTHER ARMS" printed on the magwell above the serial number and model. This is not "grey area" or illegal. I know they can not blanket ban a manufacturer, and I think alot of people are mis-informing the masses.

I am in the process of getting a list of all models with the name "panther" directly from DPMS... Does anyone have a contact with DOJ firearms? I am attempting to get something in writing/recording stating that DPMS is GTG, and maybe a clarifying statement about the "panther" issue.

[Purple K]

Being illogical, immoral or illegal has no bearing upon California's lawmakers.

[tenpercentfirearms]

If it says DPMS Model: A-15, then it might not be a listed firearm. However, it does say Panther Arms in the logo. This is a bit of a gray area and one could probably win your case, but at what cost?

[dieselpower]

Yes this was talked about. Its the difference between saying....

Colt; Colt Sporter (All)

and

Colt: Sporter (All)

the exact wording of the CCR is, well hell the DoJ website is down...I can not pull the exact wording from the CCR and PC12276. I dont have it saved on this computer either. I will update this post when they are up again. IIRC there is a difference.

[rjeusmc]

Well, I called the "AW" number for the DOJ, the gal there told me the only "AW's" banned by manufacturer are colts. How the fock are they legally able to do that, and why didn't I read that in the language of the law?

[69Mach1]

Well, I called the "AW" number for the DOJ, the gal there told me the only "AW's" banned by manufacturer are colts. How the fock are they legally able to do that, and why didn't I read that in the language of the law?

We've already been through this. Do not take any info. that the CA DOJ tells you over the phone as true, correct, or even legal. Get your lawyer to get it in writing.

[dieselpower]

Well, I called the "AW" number for the DOJ, the gal there told me the only "AW's" banned by manufacturer are colts. How the fock are they legally able to do that, and why didn't I read that in the language of the law?

LOL...don't call them....they truly have no clue...really you would get better info calling Burger King then DoJ on firearms questions.

CCR on AW by name
....blah blah blah
Colt Law Enforcement (6920)
Colt Match Target (all)
Colt Sporter (all)
Dalphon B.F.D.
DPMS Panther (all)
Eagle Arms EA-15 A2 H-BAR
Eagle Arms EA-15 E1
Eagle Arms M15 (all)
...blah blah blah

The only thing we can assume is that if a DPMS firearm is Not a member of the Panther product line, its not an AW under PC12276 (e). This is only correct if the word "Panther" is not on the roll mark. Why? Because DPMS Panther is also the name of the company on the roll mark. The company name is DPMS Firearms LLC Only the DPMS non-panther roll marks are not AWs.

http://www.dpmsinc.com/about/contact.aspx

[Army]

If you're close enough to the factory, go there and request special ''California'' markings that do not have Panther anywhere.

[Librarian]

I am in the process of getting a list of all models with the name "panther" directly from DPMS... Does anyone have a contact with DOJ firearms? I am attempting to get something in writing/recording stating that DPMS is GTG, and maybe a clarifying statement about the "panther" issue.

Welcome to Calguns.

As to the bit I quoted, well, "Don't hold your breath" as my mom would say.

The previous Attorneys-General always replied that they were not in the business of making such things clear, leaving much up to "the 54 District Attorneys of the Counties". The new office holder may be expected to be even more "helpful".

[rjeusmc]

The only thing we can assume is that if a DPMS firearm is Not a member of the Panther product line, its not an AW under PC12276 (e). This is only correct if the word "Panther" is not on the roll mark. Why? Because DPMS Panther is also the name of the company on the roll mark. The company name is DPMS Firearms LLC Only the DPMS non-panther roll marks are not AWs.

This is good dialogue... I understand the "dpms panther arms" to be the main firearms manufacture name, incorporated under the dpms LLC. Dpms panther arms is not just a line, but I see where your going with this. This is the issue I wish to clarify with the DOJ, but it won't make a lick of difference if I cant get the DOJ to respond.

If bushmaster company name for 20 years was "bushmasterxm15" and the banned item was the "xm15", I would have no problem buying an Acr or any other model with "bushmasterxm15" up top...

[ke6guj]

An "A-15" is not specified under this list. I have NEVER seen an A-15 without the "DPMS PANTHER ARMS" printed on the magwell above the serial number and model. This is not "grey area" or illegal. I know they can not blanket ban a manufacturer, and I think alot of people are mis-informing the masses.

just to let you know, there are pics of DPMS A-15s floating aroudn that do not say Panther Arms on them. they are early models.

[rjeusmc]

They are early models? How early?

[rjeusmc]

Also I understand the state cannot ban a manufacturer? Where is this written into the law or is there a supporting document.

[ke6guj]

They are early models? How early?

here is some info.

The DPMS A-15 I know of is a mid 1990s production: It includes NO mention of Panther. The roll stamp (actually it is a relief casting) states along the lines of:

DPMS - Minnesota
A-15
.223 CAL

That's what my friend has, I believe. I just had him take a pic and here it is:



So, will I be applying the torch to it tomorrow or not?

[Librarian]

Also I understand the state cannot ban a manufacturer? Where is this written into the law or is there a supporting document.

No changes are possible to the listed banned receivers, since AB2728, effective Jan 1, 2007.

See http://wiki.calgunsfoundation.org/in...7_laws#AB-2728