City Arms - not so great experience

[greasem0nkey86]

This seems to be the most reasonable section for this thread, if not, please move it mods. Thx

So I have some mixed experiences at City Arms. I got my HSC there a couple of years ago no problem. I purchased a FNP via gunbroker and called City to send their FFL to the FFL out of state, no problem there, got that taken care of without any hickups.

The pistol is due to arrive on the 9th. My friend and I show up at 11:30am on the 7th to see if I could start the DROS paperwork (IE name, address, etc, the non-important parts of the paperwork), We stroll around the store waiting for someone to free up to help us out. I'm in uniform for work and my friend is in civies, we're standing in front of the display case and are greeted like this by the older russian guy (never got his name, nor do I care for it anymore), I recall it like this "What do you kids want/need?". And my friend recalls it like this "Hey kids, what do you want/need?" First off, you guys just opened shop no more than an hour and you're already in a pissy mood? Second of all, directing us as "kids" is an insult. Yes we may LOOK young, but thats no reason to call us kids, a simple, guy or fella, would've sufficed without comming off as a jackass. And THIRD, his tone/attitude came off as "great, gotta deal with some customers". So I try to ignore his greeting thinking he may just be having a bad day. So I let him know I have a pistol en route and would want to TRY and start paperwork. He takes off his glasses, sets it no the case and says something along the lines of "Why do I want to break the law?". We try to explain, but he keeps repeating the same line. My friend eventually gets through saying just the name, address, and basic parts of the paperwork, he replies that it doesn't take more than 5 minutes. Now I'm skeptical, I haven't DROS'd in a while, and I DO NOT recall it taking only 5 minutes. He then steps away from us and helps another customer. I didn't even have the chance to explain that I would be traveling from SSF to Pacifica DURING MY LUNCH HOUR to do the paperwork. This little "discussion" lasted no more than 2 minutes MAX. Ok fine, we just got stood up my the jackass of the store, I have to get to work soon, so we left.

Today is Tuesday. The pistol should've already arrived and was ready for the DROS. I take my lunch break, call up City, same old guy picks up the phone, I ask if a FNP came in via USPS. He replies with his heavy accent that they don't open packages until after 6pm. REALLY!? I WANT TO SEE MY FIRST PISTOL AND THIS IS WHAT YOU TELL ME!? Great fine, one day, not a big deal, but he doesn't even provide an explanation for it. I call back after 6pm to check if my pistol arrived, I was greeted by the younger gentleman there and confirmed my pistol has arrived. I ask him if its true that they open packages after 6pm, he confirms his, I ask for the reasoning behind it, its because they have A LOT to take work to do. Ok, at least he provided a reasonable explanation without giving an attitude about it.

So another trip to City tomorrow to do the DROS, and another trip back to have the hostage released. After that, I'm most likely going to be taking my business elsewhere.

Has anyone else had a similar experiences with this older guy?

[ScOuTeDbYmE]

Now that greasemonkey made this post, I am going to identify myself as said friend. I have only stepped into City Arms twice in my life. Both were negative experiences. The first conversation did not last more than 10 minutes and the second, not even 5!

The first time would date back to...possibly 2006. I was looking to purchase my first firearm, a Remington 700. I show up with another Marine buddy of mine who already made three purchases, a Remington, 700, a Kimber 1911, and a Remington 870. (He was very content with his service from them but understood that the Russians that worked the counter were quite brash.) I approach the counter and was asked what I was looking for. All I can remember was telling them I SPECIFICALLY wanted a Remington 700 with a scope. Being that it was my first time buying a firearm with no experience, I didn't know ****! They asked me what model I was looking for and how much I wanted to spend. After showing me ONE 700, they tried to sell me their Saiga rifles for the remaining time I was at the store. The whole time I kept asking for an estimate for a 700 with a scope and they kept telling me the Saiga was a better choice for cheaper. I'm a Marine. I want my goddamn 700. That was the end of that day and City Arms until this past Saturday.

Now I recently purchased a Springfield XD-40 V-10 which was shipped to the newly opened Golden Gate Guns down by San Bruno. Unfortunately, Tabors doesn't do shipping FFLs so i chose GGG but I digress. I told greasemonkey to try City Arms as another resource to have his FNP sent to because GGG has limited hours and is a tad farther away from our residence. Now skipping ahead to the dialogue between the old Russian croak (because he called me a kid) and me, I mentioned to HIM that I recently had a gun transferred and the gun store it was shipped to had already "started" my paperwork. Now when I stay started, I meant by having the basics down (name, address, phone number). By NO MEANS, did they start the DROS process WITHOUT the handgun present. This was understood by both parties. I did arrive on the date my handgun was delivered to make sure the registration process was good-to-go, and it was. By the time the croak had lectured us for 20 seconds on losing his license and refusing to hear NOT EVEN TWO SENTENCES from my lips, he had already passed us over for another waiting customer. I spent 20 minutes outside the store waiting for greasemonkey, another 10 meandering inside the store window shopping and admiring guns, and get less than one minute of shtty service.


FK this place. I'm never ever setting foot nor even mentioning this place to anyone else. This gun store is dead to me.

[nagorb]

This seems to be the most reasonable section for this thread, if not, please move it mods. Thx

So I have some mixed experiences at City Arms. I got my HSC there a couple of years ago no problem. I purchased a FNP via gunbroker and called City to send their FFL to the FFL out of state, no problem there, got that taken care of without any hickups.

The pistol is due to arrive on the 9th. My friend and I show up at 11:30am on the 7th to see if I could start the DROS paperwork (IE name, address, etc, the non-important parts of the paperwork), We stroll around the store waiting for someone to free up to help us out. I'm in uniform for work and my friend is in civies, we're standing in front of the display case and are greeted like this by the older russian guy (never got his name, nor do I care for it anymore), I recall it like this "What do you kids want/need?". And my friend recalls it like this "Hey kids, what do you want/need?" First off, you guys just opened shop no more than an hour and you're already in a pissy mood? Second of all, directing us as "kids" is an insult. Yes we may LOOK young, but thats no reason to call us kids, a simple, guy or fella, would've sufficed without comming off as a jackass. And THIRD, his tone/attitude came off as "great, gotta deal with some customers". So I try to ignore his greeting thinking he may just be having a bad day. So I let him know I have a pistol en route and would want to TRY and start paperwork. He takes off his glasses, sets it no the case and says something along the lines of "Why do I want to break the law?". We try to explain, but he keeps repeating the same line. My friend eventually gets through saying just the name, address, and basic parts of the paperwork, he replies that it doesn't take more than 5 minutes. Now I'm skeptical, I haven't DROS'd in a while, and I DO NOT recall it taking only 5 minutes. He then steps away from us and helps another customer. I didn't even have the chance to explain that I would be traveling from SSF to Pacifica DURING MY LUNCH HOUR to do the paperwork. This little "discussion" lasted no more than 2 minutes MAX. Ok fine, we just got stood up my the jackass of the store, I have to get to work soon, so we left.

Today is Tuesday. The pistol should've already arrived and was ready for the DROS. I take my lunch break, call up City, same old guy picks up the phone, I ask if a FNP came in via USPS. He replies with his heavy accent that they don't open packages until after 6pm. REALLY!? I WANT TO SEE MY FIRST PISTOL AND THIS IS WHAT YOU TELL ME!? Great fine, one day, not a big deal, but he doesn't even provide an explanation for it. I call back after 6pm to check if my pistol arrived, I was greeted by the younger gentleman there and confirmed my pistol has arrived. I ask him if its true that they open packages after 6pm, he confirms his, I ask for the reasoning behind it, its because they have A LOT to take work to do. Ok, at least he provided a reasonable explanation without giving an attitude about it.

So another trip to City tomorrow to do the DROS, and another trip back to have the hostage released. After that, I'm most likely going to be taking my business elsewhere.

Has anyone else had a similar experiences with this older guy?

Never had a bad experience with city arms, never been called kid, usually young man, always give me good deals. I believe the guy you talked to was the owner. Your really gonna be upset he called you kid? sounds like you might have a chip on your shoulder.

DROS only takes about 30 mins, not sure but I believe you can't start it until the gun is present.

[nagorb]

Now that greasemonkey made this post, I am going to identify myself as said friend. I have only stepped into City Arms twice in my life. Both were negative experiences. The first conversation did not last more than 10 minutes and the second, not even 5!

The first time would date back to...possibly 2006. I was looking to purchase my first firearm, a Remington 700. I show up with another Marine buddy of mine who already made three purchases, a Remington, 700, a Kimber 1911, and a Remington 870. (He was very content with his service from them but understood that the Russians that worked the counter were quite brash.) I approach the counter and was asked what I was looking for. All I can remember was telling them I SPECIFICALLY wanted a Remington 700 with a scope. Being that it was my first time buying a firearm with no experience, I didn't know ****! They asked me what model I was looking for and how much I wanted to spend. After showing me ONE 700, they tried to sell me their Saiga rifles for the remaining time I was at the store. The whole time I kept asking for an estimate for a 700 with a scope and they kept telling me the Saiga was a better choice for cheaper. I'm a Marine. I want my goddamn 700. That was the end of that day and City Arms until this past Saturday.

Now I recently purchased a Springfield XD-40 V-10 which was shipped to the newly opened Golden Gate Guns down by San Bruno. Unfortunately, Tabors doesn't do shipping FFLs so i chose GGG but I digress. I told greasemonkey to try City Arms as another resource to have his FNP sent to because GGG has limited hours and is a tad farther away from our residence. Now skipping ahead to the dialogue between the old Russian croak (because he called me a kid) and me, I mentioned to HIM that I recently had a gun transferred and the gun store it was shipped to had already "started" my paperwork. Now when I stay started, I meant by having the basics down (name, address, phone number). By NO MEANS, did they start the DROS process WITHOUT the handgun present. This was understood by both parties. I did arrive on the date my handgun was delivered to make sure the registration process was good-to-go, and it was. By the time the croak had lectured us for 20 seconds on losing his license and refusing to hear NOT EVEN TWO SENTENCES from my lips, he had already passed us over for another waiting customer. I spent 20 minutes outside the store waiting for greasemonkey, another 10 meandering inside the store window shopping and admiring guns, and get less than one minute of shtty service.


FK this place. I'm never ever setting foot nor even mentioning this place to anyone else. This gun store is dead to me.

How much time does it take to fill out name, address etc? maybe 5 mins

[tenpercentfirearms]

You can't start the DROS until the handgun is present.

On a busy day, I wouldn't open packages until all of my customers were out of the shop either. A guy who buys a gun on Gun Broker instead of through me isn't going to get priority on the phone over a customer sitting right in front of me. But that is the main reason I don't answer the phone when I am with a customer at all. I usually am not that busy so I will take a peak over and say, "Yeah there is a package over there with your name on it." However, I currently have a shop in a closet sized store so doing that is pretty easy.

I never treat kids like kids in my shop. You could come in and be 12 and I will still hand you rifles and handguns to check out. Everyone is a potential long term customer no matter how old they are and especially if you start treating them with respect early. I have never called anyone kid and thanks to this thread, I never will.

My question is how much is their transfer fee? It kind of sounds like they could care less about your transfer business, which many shops could care less about transfer business. However, non-stocking FFLs like Roger's Relics in Santa Clara are first class in the transfer business because that is all they do.

[JOEKILLA]

Never had a bad experience with city arms, never been called kid, usually young man, always give me good deals. I believe the guy you talked to was the owner. Your really gonna be upset he called you kid? sounds like you might have a chip on your shoulder.

DROS only takes about 30 mins, not sure but I believe you can't start it until the gun is present.

The OP was referring to "Uncle V". Never had a problem with him. One hell of a guy if you ask me.

He calls me "young man" as well.

This reminds me, I gotta stop by to say hi to them.

[Capt_Communist]

not trying to be disrespectful in any way, but I believe the way he speaks is more of a culture thing than them being offensive.

I bought a 220 from them a few years back and had a ok experience.... nothing bad, but nothing too good.

All in all if I'm in Pacifica with some free time I would patronize their shop again and maybe buy something uber cool if they had it, but that's is.

[cmichini]

You can't start the DROS until the handgun is present.

I thought they just needed the serial number for a handgun to START DROS. I've had someone do that for me.

Just wondering if this is, dictated by fact, law or policy.

[Oceanbob]

Hey Kids

Here's my take:

1.You buy a gun off Gun Broker instead of ordering it thru City Arms.

2. You cheated them out of any commision.

3. You show up like a hot-shot on the 7th, expecting them to waste a bunch of time and break the law....then act like a little kid when they decide to actually help a customer who is standing in their store.

4. Then you act like an angry kid again by trying to actually HURT their business by complaining on this website.


Feel better?

[thevic]

you just gotta know how to speak to the russians.

if i ever did an order id take it to golden gate guns in san bruno. yeah the store barely has an inventory, but they are disgustingly nice and dont screw you on fees.

[kemasa]

I think that you need to look at this a bit more objectively. You want them to start some of the paperwork, then put it aside for when you come in again because you want to save a few minutes later. You will be taking more of their time overall and it is more of a hassle and can cause mistakes to be made. You could start to fill out part of the 4473, but you can not sign it and then there could be a question as to whether you were the one who started to fill it out.

To be SPECIFIC, the DROS is done ONLINE, so you can not start part of that. You need to have the firearm. Some FFLs will start it with the serial number, but I think that the DOJ sent out a letter saying not to do that. In the past, some FFLs would submit a bogus serial number and then correct it, this is no longer allowed.

It is not reasonable to expect them to instantly open the package containing the firearm for you, bypassing what they normally do, which can cause them to make a mistake in logging it. You also seem to think that you have a right to demand all the reasons why they do what they do. They should give you the reasons, but when a person comes in wanting to fill out the paperwork before they can start it will no doubt cause them to question whether they want to do business with you at all. You were wasting their time.

I think that you are being overly sensitive on the "kid" part.

While the concept of the customer always being right is interesting, it is not actually the case.

[halifax]

I think that you need to look at this a bit more objectively. You want them to start some of the paperwork, then put it aside for when you come in again because you want to save a few minutes later. You will be taking more of their time overall and it is more of a hassle and can cause mistakes to be made. You could start to fill out part of the 4473, but you can not sign it and then there could be a question as to whether you were the one who started to fill it out.
...

I think City Arms use computers for the 4473 (EZ-4473). That would make it impractical to start it one day and then come back to it.

[CSACANNONEER]

Hey kids, if you don't like a store's policies, open your own. I didn't see anything that indicated that the store was picking on you, doing anything illegal or even abnormal. Yea, you're excited to get your very first handgun but, so what? The bussiness is not going to stop everything, close their doors and go through every box a couple hours early just to make you happy. If you are younger than the grumpy old man, he has the right to call you a kid and you have the right not to like it. In fact, if you are older than him, he still has the right to call you a kid and you still have the right not to like it. It sure sounds to me like you are spoiled "kids" who are complaining about someone not catering to your wishes.

BTW, I have never been to the shop in question and have zero connection to it other than I used to fish off the Pacifica peir.

[Ishoot]

I've been to City Arms many times and have had a fair experience through out. Nothing to write home about but not ready to boycott the store either. I've also been called "kid" by the owner but have never had my pride or feelings hurt because of it even though I'm in my mid-thirties. I've transferred a few firearms through them and have had to wait just like everyone else for them to open the day's packages "the day after they arrived" and do the DROS then...even though my time is SUPER important and very limited. Even through all those "horrible experiences" I didn't go around trying to hurt an honest business just because they didn't cater specifically to me like my mom used to... Hey my only advice at this point, is to not sweat the small stuff and good luck in the service with that sense of self-entitlement.

[nagorb]

The OP was referring to "Uncle V". Never had a problem with him. One hell of a guy if you ask me.

He calls me "young man" as well.

This reminds me, I gotta stop by to say hi to them.

I think they kinda grow on you, they're really the only shop I'll go to now. They almost always have the best prices on handguns and if they know you they will usually give you a deal. My last purchase from them OTD was as cheap or cheaper than any other shop on the peninsula.