Fixed mag AK pistol?

[jumbopanda]

So has anyone built one? I'm talking about using a flat or blank, since any complete receiver transferred through an FFL would be subject to drop testing requirements. With a fixed mag it would be perfectly legal wouldn't it?

[Matt C]

Same problem as an AR pistol with a fixed mag, the "Safe list". It's not an AW though as long as the mag has <10 rounds.

[jumbopanda]

Hmm, this is what it says in the DOJ website:

"Effective January 1, 2001, no handgun may be manufactured within California, imported into California for sale, lent, given, kept for sale, or offered/exposed for sale unless that handgun model has passed firing, safety, and drop tests and is certified for sale in California by the Department of Justice."

But what about building it out of state and just bringing it in for personal use?

[KenpoProfessor]

Hmm, this is what it says in the DOJ website:

"Effective January 1, 2001, no handgun may be manufactured within California, imported into California for sale, lent, given, kept for sale, or offered/exposed for sale unless that handgun model has passed firing, safety, and drop tests and is certified for sale in California by the Department of Justice."

But what about building it out of state and just bringing it in for personal use?

How are you going to get an AR pistol receiver into CA to take it out and build it up? Once a rifle, always a rifle and AK receiver is not on safe list to import.

Have a great Kenpo day

Clyde

[jumbopanda]

It says import for sale, I'm talking about personal use. And if you're building your own AK receiver, you can designate it as a pistol.

[JHC]

I know of a guy (not me) that has built an AK pistol. It's a single-shot, self-ejecting with bolt hold-open, and is reloaded through the ejection port directly into the chamber.

*He built the receiver from a flat and stamped it,"Pistol Only"
*It has no threaded barrel
*The place where the mag should go has a 30 round dummy mag pinned in to act as a bolt-hold open device.
*This dummy mag holds zero rounds, the follower is limited in travel to less than a quarter inch and has a rod welded in place to prevent a round from being inserted in the one spot it would fit.
*The dummy/bolt hold is released by a small lever on it's side (very similar in appearance to the lever mags seen around here.

In my opinion it's legal but I sure wouldn't want to be caught with it.

[AJAX22]

Personel use is NOT manufacturing, manufacturing is for resale and transfer.

there is nothing illigal about building from scratch your own AR fixed mag 10 round pistol, or ak 10 round fixed mag pistol.

To cover your ***** stamp 'not for transfer' on it

[jumbopanda]

Personel use is NOT manufacturing, manufacturing is for resale and transfer.

there is nothing illigal about building from scratch your own AR fixed mag 10 round pistol, or ak 10 round fixed mag pistol.

To cover your ***** stamp 'not for transfer' on it

Ah that's an interesting point. I think I heard this somewhere too, can anyone confirm it just to be safe?

[Matt C]

Ah that's an interesting point. I think I heard this somewhere too, can anyone confirm it just to be safe?

IMO it's a really grey area, I don't think you are going to be safe doing that.

[ts]

Why would it have to be fixed mag? This is not a rifle. It is a pistol. I would think that you could use pre-ban 30 rounders in it just as long as it is not semi-auto. I might be very wrong though.

[Matt C]

Why would it have to be fixed mag? This is not a rifle. It is a pistol. I would think that you could use pre-ban 30 rounders in it just as long as it is not semi-auto. I might be very wrong though.

It accepts a magazine outside the pistol grip, and thus is an AW. Also it might have a threaded barrel.

[jumbopanda]

Why would it have to be fixed mag? This is not a rifle. It is a pistol. I would think that you could use pre-ban 30 rounders in it just as long as it is not semi-auto. I might be very wrong though.

I want one that is semi-auto, but yes, if it were not semi auto then you could use preban detachables.

IMO it's a really grey area, I don't think you are going to be safe doing that.

It's gray, but I think its worth looking into. The rest of that paragraph refers to sales, importing for sale, offer or expose for sale, etc. so it's a possibility.

EDIT: maybe not, otherwise it wouldn't be illegal to put together a standard cap magazine...

[thedrickel]

I think it's a little worse than a gray area. Unless you can find somewhere in the PC that "manufacture" somehow doesn't include unlicensed home builders, I am going to think that it includes me. Gotta see if "manufacture" is defined somewhere in the PC.

If they were legal I would build a krink with a fixed 10 rounder ASAP.

[jumbopanda]

Bah forget it. "Manufacture" applies to just making something, even if it isn't for sale. The term is used to refer to AWs and standard cap mags, which we all know cannot be manufactured even for personal use.


Curses, foiled again by Kalifornia!

[AJAX22]

As it applies to drop testing 'manufacture' is specific to production for the purpouses of sale or transfer.

the DOJ even admitted this in that memo regarding 80% 1911 frames. you can 'make' up to five firearms per year for personel use without applying for a CA firearms manufacturer permit.

the drop safety requirement is only applied to pistols that are trasfered from the manufacturer to the end user through an 01 FFL as inventory.

If you're keeping it for personel use, you are the 'maker' not a 'manufacturer'

The state of CA relies heavily on the BATFE's wording and definition in this regard, since after all, the BATFE is the entity who actually determines what constitutes 'making' or manufacturing

I'm way to tired right now to get into it, the short story is: the doj issued a memo specificly stating that home built pistols for personel use were exempt from drop testing safety requirements so long as they were never transfered through a dealer in CA.