Loaded gun in a house-fire: self-discharge?

[Ground Loop]

Forgive me if this has been covered on Mythbusters before..

If you have a semi-automatic gun with a live cartridge in the chamber, and the gun is heated in a fire, what will be the ultimate outcome?

• Heat triggers the primer, and gun fires with the full normal effect.
• Powder reaches flash-point and ignites spontaneously, firing the gun.
• Heat melts the lead-core bullet to where it is ineffective, before ignition.
• Polymer frame melts, perhaps disabling the gun.

I would imagine that the rest of the cartridges in the magazine might light off first, probably destroying at least the grip.

In an all-metal gun, passive safeties don't seem like they would accomplish much if the cartridge effectively "fires itself". A revolver might light off the top round first as well.

Just thinking out loud here..

Anyone have any first-hand or confirmed tales of a cooked (loaded) gun?

Just to be clear, I'm talking about a round in the chamber, with the whole gun heated to extremes.

[Noobert]

it will fire if the cartridge becomes hot enough

[4ME&MYHOUSE]

Super strange... I was thinking about that today!

[Synergy]

Every state of mater: solid, liquid or gas has an ignition temperature. Once enough heat is applied it will ignite. Due to a chemical decomposition called pyrolysis. Basically once anything is heated enough it will produce a gas that ignites and a chemical decomposition occurs. Or in the case of a flammable or combustible material it will ignite. You would have to find the chemical compound of a primer or gun powder find its ignition temperature. Once you find that, lets says its 720 degrees F. The fire would have to produce enough heat to radiate through the frame into the chamber, onto the brass case and heat the powder/primer. Then yes it could ignite and fire the bullet.

[Baxter]

Should explode, but not be propelled in the same manner as firing the weapon. Except maybe the one in the tube.

[Cokebottle]

Should explode, but not be propelled in the same manner as firing the weapon. Except maybe the one in the tube.

Which is the point.... he's got one in the chamber, and that will be expelled just as if the gun were fired.

Even when stored, always keep the barrel pointed in a safe direction.
If you live on the ground floor, that direction is most likely down. If you live upstairs, then "up" is perhaps a safer direction.

Don't store it in the closet with the barrel pointed into your neighbor's bedroom.

Our chambered HD guns are stored in Galco holsters that are bolted to the bedframe... barrel down.

[Ground Loop]

Cokebottle is thinking ahead to my point.. I keep loaded guns in a MiniVault or similar pistol-safe. I don't have any confidence the 'can' would contain a bullet, and there aren't many safe directions for an upstairs urban gun.

Does anyone know the typical 'flashpoint' for a primer or smokeless powder? If it's above the melting point of lead, I'd take that as good news.

Maybe a ceramic or steel-plate insert for small gunsafes? Something that could reliably stop/fragment a magnum round?

Just to head off the next 10 posts.. I know you can leave the chamber empty.

[CHS]

The one in the chamber, assuming it goes off first, will send the bullet out of the barrel.

However, when a cartridge "cooks off" versus being fired normally, it's under a whole lot less power. The powders break down under the intense heat, and when they finally go are pretty anemic.

The projectile is probably not going to end up killing anyone, but keep the barrel in a safe direction anyways

[Ground Loop]

That's an interesting point. Anyone have any experimental/anecdotal stories?

A test barrel, torch, and chrono.. Maybe this is Mythbusters material after all.

[POLICESTATE]

Makes you wonder what will happen with all the boxed ammo, probably sound something like loud popcorn

[POLICESTATE]

That's an interesting point. Anyone have any experimental/anecdotal stories?

A test barrel, torch, and chrono.. Maybe this is Mythbusters material after all.

As a matter of fact, okay this is second-hand.

Back in 1991/1992 there was a friend (Jilly Rizzo) of Frank Sinatra's who was driving across the street into the Mission Hills Country Club. Some drunk driver ran a stop sign at over 50mph and t-boned this guy's car. Of course the drunk was on a suspended license. I won't go into that, the guy was a real piece of work.

Anyway, the jag had double gas tanks, one caught fire and the car burns with Jilly in it, along with a handgun and some ammo. All the rounds cooked off, however no one was injured as a result of this. I started working there in that very gate a few weeks after the incident and the security guard who trained me told me about the incident as it all happened in front of him and another guard (who I also worked with).

Link to the article: http://articles.latimes.com/1992-05-...-sinatra-jilly

Apparently Mr. Rizzo was also a bodyguard of sorts to Mr. Sinatra.

The guy who killed him, he continued on down the street, hopped the fence and got his wife to come out and say she was driving.

He was out on bail for months (where I had a few run-ins with him myself because neighbors complained about him) and he was a total piece of **** He ultimately got 15 years to life for 2nd degree murder.

Anyway, yeah, your rounds get hot enough they will cook off.

[Noobert]

I'm surprised no one posted this yet

[glockman19]

Mythbusters didi this one. One in the chamber ready to fire will fire. everything else will just cook off.

[CHS]

Mythbusters didi this one. One in the chamber ready to fire will fire. everything else will just cook off.

The one thing to notice though, is that the cartridge was a .44mag in a gun, and didn't even penetrate the barrier.

Cooking off a round takes so much energy out of the powder, that it's not nearly as deadly as actually setting off the cartridge properly.

[Decoligny]

Which is the point.... he's got one in the chamber, and that will be expelled just as if the gun were fired.

Even when stored, always keep the barrel pointed in a safe direction.
If you live on the ground floor, that direction is most likely down. If you live upstairs, then "up" is perhaps a safer direction.

Don't store it in the closet with the barrel pointed into your neighbor's bedroom.

Our chambered HD guns are stored in Galco holsters that are bolted to the bedframe... barrel down.

Until the holster melts, and the gun falls to the floor pointing towards a wall that a bullet could pass through and possibly kill one of the firemen responding to the blaze.