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  • allenst65
    Member
    • Nov 2005
    • 343

    More Turners DROS weirdness

    ... this time at the newest store in Chino Hills.

    The other day a handgun popped onto their consignment list that was of interest. I went to see it and found it had just come in the night before, so it still had 29 days left on the 30 day hold. Being something I wanted and thinking it would sell during the waiting period, I told the salesman I was interested in buying it, knowing that their policy with consignment guns required full payment since there was no layaway.

    As with the many other consignments I'd bought through Turners before, I knew I would have to return after it was released from the 30 day hold, initiate the DROS, and then return for a third time 10 days later to pick it up. I should have said 'presumed' since this time the salesman said I would also have to DROS it immediately since I was completing the full purchase at that moment in order to hold it.

    Now here is the kicker, due to the 30 day pickup requirement of the DROS and the remaining 29 days left on the consignment hold, he said I would only have a 1 day window in which to pick it up ! This was completely contradictory to every other Turners consignment sale I've done in which they required me to wait until it was released from the 30 day consignment hold before I could DROS it.

    I protested and asked for the manager, who responded verbatim that I would have to DROS it on the spot, being so kind as to reiterate that I would only have a 1 day window in which to pick it up. He went on to say that this has been their policy, despite me saying over and over that none of my other consignment sales at other Turners stores have gone this way.

    One other curiousity, Turners had taken some flak for the fact they DROS their consignment guns as pawn returns, while every other dealer I've dealt with lists them as PPTs even if the seller is not present. This time, as the young salesman was going over the DROS issue with me, he seemed hesitant and called in the manager to inform him that he could not DROS it under SB15 since the model number was different that the current model on the approved list. The manager first asked "what is SB15?", and after the salesman explained, they did some head scratching and decided to list the transaction as Curio/Relic/Olympic Pistol/Exempt. They also wrote "30 day multiple purchase exemption" in the exemption description box.

    Talk about confusing, has Turners indeed changed their policies on consignment sales, or are the folks in the new Chino Hills 'showcase store' inhaling too much of that fine bovine aroma? What are the legalities on the 30 day (pawn) hold and how does this affect the timeframe for submitting the DROS ?

    Thanks,
    SA
  • #2
    NeoWeird
    Veteran Member
    • Dec 2005
    • 3342

    I believe the pawn return is only for one the person who put it on consignment goes back in to get it. I overheard my FFL talking about it to someone and they were saying that it is a 30 day exempt transfer as well, so that if someone comes in with a dozen pistols and pawns them, they can return with the money and get them all back. Not sure as to all the details as I was only overhearing it, but I was interested and paying enough attention to catch that tidbit.

    I've never done a consignment purchase, but chances are it's a new store with a new manager who is absolutely by the books the way he was trained and the other stores are either sloppy or he was misinformed. Seeing as it's the new Turners store, I'd chalk it up to the store and not the chain that is doing things differently than normal.
    quemadmodum gladius neminem occidit, occidentis telum est. - Lucius Annaeus
    a sword never kills anybody; it's a tool in the killer's hand.

    Comment

    • #3
      stevie
      Veteran Member
      • Oct 2005
      • 3856

      I've done a few consignment purchasing from Turners. I have always had to pay in full, wait the 30 days and then start DROS. So you actually have to make 3 trips, pay, paper and pickup. The Pawn thing is because the seller is not actually at the store at time of sale. So it is not a PPT sale.

      Comment

      • #4
        tankerman
        I need a LIFE!!
        • Mar 2006
        • 24240

        Management of Turners is weak. If the ownership had any idea of what having uninformed people handling transfers/sales could do their business, then they would have fix it long ago. I can not believe that they do not have posted company policies for their employees to follow. When it comes to firearm sales/transfers, no decision making should be left in the hands of a sales person. Policies need to state specific directions that follow the law and good business practice. I bet Turners ends up losing their FFL licenses. Way to lax

        Comment

        • #5
          thomye
          Member
          • Aug 2006
          • 338

          haha, i hate turners, especially norwalk. i only shop at Martin B. Rettings now. http://www.retting.com.

          they are much nicer and knowledgeable. The best part, i've been sending the director of customer service my receipts for every gun i've purchased since i complained about their service last year.
          If GUNS kill people, then SPOONS make people fat.

          Comment

          • #6
            VeryCoolCat
            I need a LIFE!!
            • Feb 2006
            • 11275

            Originally posted by thomye
            haha, i hate turners, especially norwalk. i only shop at Martin B. Rettings now. http://www.retting.com.

            they are much nicer and knowledgeable. The best part, i've been sending the director of customer service my receipts for every gun i've purchased since i complained about their service last year.
            I've never been to rettings... I first checked the website and thought... HOLY MOTHER OF GOD THATS EXPENSIVE. I called them seeing their transfer rates... but they said that had other things for sale. Maybe I'll check it... today.... right now. Bye
            Originally posted by Kestryll
            The volume of blood necessary to achieve erection would cause you to either pass out or if you didn't and managed to maintain an erection you would likely die from lack of oxygen to the heart and brain.
            Originally posted by ivanimal
            Just be glad you are not his next door neighbor. I am sure there are "good tunes" flowing out the window. I am imagining a cop car pulling up at 1:30 AM asking "Are you having a party?" and Bundo sayin "Nope just me and the BG's"

            Comment

            • #7
              Dump1567
              Senior Member
              • Sep 2002
              • 1621

              Originally posted by thomye
              haha, i hate turners, especially norwalk. i only shop at Martin B. Rettings now. http://www.retting.com.

              they are much nicer and knowledgeable. The best part, i've been sending the director of customer service my receipts for every gun i've purchased since i complained about their service last year.

              I notice he sells on AuctionArms, but states "no CA sells" on a lot of his handguns. Are these guns he bought out of state, or are these CA guns that he just doesn't know how to put on consignment?
              Last edited by Dump1567; 03-04-2007, 2:09 PM.
              Watch & Pray

              Comment

              • #8
                VeryCoolCat
                I need a LIFE!!
                • Feb 2006
                • 11275

                Originally posted by VeryCoolCat
                I've never been to rettings... I first checked the website and thought... HOLY MOTHER OF GOD THATS EXPENSIVE. I called them seeing their transfer rates... but they said that had other things for sale. Maybe I'll check it... today.... right now. Bye
                Ok I'm back. Had a good selection. Prices were ok. They have primers and powders but no other reload supplies.

                WAY TOO BUSY, they have a pretty damn good/cheap C&R selection.
                Originally posted by Kestryll
                The volume of blood necessary to achieve erection would cause you to either pass out or if you didn't and managed to maintain an erection you would likely die from lack of oxygen to the heart and brain.
                Originally posted by ivanimal
                Just be glad you are not his next door neighbor. I am sure there are "good tunes" flowing out the window. I am imagining a cop car pulling up at 1:30 AM asking "Are you having a party?" and Bundo sayin "Nope just me and the BG's"

                Comment

                • #9
                  ocabj
                  Calguns Addict
                  • Oct 2005
                  • 7924

                  A lot of smaller, one man / mom and pop, type operations are starting to get more customers from Turners in the past couple of years. Frustration over store employees, policies, prices, and selection of products has caused many to stop going to Turners altogether and go with local competitors and the Internet.

                  Turners probably still gets the bulk of the gun owner customer base in SoCal, but I'll tell you what: When that Bass Pro Shop in Rancho Cucamonga opens, Turners is going to drop a huge load in their pants. While I'm sure the retail prices will be the same as Turners for the same product, people will go to Bass Pro simply because of the name and it being the new store in town. Just like how Home Base took customers away from Builder's Emporium, then Home Depot from Home Base.

                  I doubt Turners will close down shop or anything, but I definitely know they're going to take a huge hit in profits.

                  My shooting buddies always talk over breakfast in the clubhouse about how Turners is failing to address the needs of shooters with poor selection and pricing of reloading supplies and equipment, as well as shooting accessories. If Turners were to reevaluate their reloading sales alone and address this area, they could gain back their customer base and will be able to fend off Bass Pro.

                  Distinguished Rifleman #1924
                  NRA Certified Instructor (Rifle and Metallic Cartridge Reloading) and RSO
                  NRL22 Match Director at WEGC

                  https://www.ocabj.net

                  Comment

                  • #10
                    NIB
                    Senior Member
                    • Oct 2005
                    • 549

                    I walked into the Norwalk Turners 5 days ago. That was the smallest selection of guns I have ever seen. They had more single action revolvers then Glocks, Sigs and 1911s put together on display.

                    Comment

                    • #11
                      CALI-gula
                      Calguns Addict
                      • Jan 2006
                      • 7039

                      Originally posted by thomye
                      haha, i hate turners, especially norwalk. i only shop at Martin B. Rettings now. http://www.retting.com.

                      they are much nicer and knowledgeable. The best part, i've been sending the director of customer service my receipts for every gun i've purchased since i complained about their service last year.
                      Rettings does NOT do consignment sales of handguns not OK by the SB-15 DOJ Safety Approval list. They will only buy then sell outside of CA and NOT to CA citizens, with no ties to a standing consignment owner. I can understand WHY they don't like consignment issues, but I hate that they are sending SO many guns out of CA. They will sometimes do consignment on high end C&R or rifles, but rare.

                      All those guns you see on Auction Arms from Rettings are guns they bought out-right, and are exporting from California. Many may have been from walk-in business, others may have been from going to estate auctions. They have repeatedly REFUSED to do consignment on handguns not on DOJ list, ever since SB-15 went into effect, longer than LA Guns!

                      They claim there is no exemption for consignment in the law for dealers, that allows them to sell non-SB15 handguns in their display cases - and they may be right. They note it was only Lockyer's OPINION as he proabably did not want to get sued by people stating SB15 was preventing them from liquidating their assets or blocking inheritance, which is also why consignments and PPT are 1 per 30 day exempt. ALSO, PPTs were written into the law because they did not want Joe Blow selling his guns outside of the oversight of an FFL and 4473/DROS to Joe Criminal up the street. Theory was, if you couldn't sell it, you would eventually find a way, even if a law-abiding citizen. Then you might think you were selling your handgunt to a great friend or neighbor, not realizing he has done time in San Quentin. Still, while the PPT portion is in the law, the consignment portion by dealers is not, for hnsguns not on the SB15 list. Legislative amendments should be enacted to put the exemption for consignment in the text of the law, not just in bulletins or memos. It was an oversight that DOJ corrected by opinion only.

                      And I still think that since is unlikely we will ever get it completely rescinded, SB-15 should only apply to the handguns that came out the year SB-15 went active and after. What they did was make a law apply retroactively to guns 50 years old and newer - that would be like stating a 1969 Mustang must have air-bags to be sold in CA by dealers or making it meet year 2007 crash/smog tests just like a new 2007 Toyota Camry!! I am still wondering how they made the retroactive application stick??!?

                      ------------------------------------

                      Also, for what it's worth, most all other dealers DO have a 30 day hold but they don't put the gun out UNTIL the 30 days are up. The guys you were talking to at that Turner's must have been wrong or don't even know their own company's policy. I have bought SEVERAL handguns AND rifles at Turners off their consignment rack and they NEVER made me do the DROS if the 30 day DND was in effect - in fact - THEY WOULDN'T EVEN LET ME when I asked, but told me I did have to pay the gun off completely to hold it for the 30 days UNTIL the DND was over. And what is "DND" ? That is exactly what all the Turner's write on the consignment sale tag indicating "DO NOT DROS UNTIL XX/XX/XXXX" date. The guys you were dealing with were bone-heads.
                      Last edited by CALI-gula; 03-04-2007, 6:45 PM.
                      ------------------------

                      Comment

                      • #12
                        Maddog5150
                        I need a LIFE!!
                        • Feb 2006
                        • 10526

                        Originally posted by tankerman
                        Management of Turners is weak. If the ownership had any idea of what having uninformed people handling transfers/sales could do their business, then they would have fix it long ago. I can not believe that they do not have posted company policies for their employees to follow. When it comes to firearm sales/transfers, no decision making should be left in the hands of a sales person. Policies need to state specific directions that follow the law and good business practice. I bet Turners ends up losing their FFL licenses. Way to lax
                        LOL. Way too lax? You ever bought a firearm at turners? The paperwork is double from any other FFL. Wonder why they are still around? They cover thier *** where as other shops have gone down. If they would of lost thier FFL it would of happened years ago.

                        Sucks your experience at Chino. I would talk to the store manager and not an assistant. I cant remember the store managers name but he is a pretty good guy and he will take care of you.
                        Buy my EO Tech XPS3-0!!!

                        For those nutjobs who like to use the word "gouge"
                        Note: I did not write the above article.

                        Any carpenters in Socal want a side project?

                        sigpic

                        Comment

                        • #13
                          jaymz
                          CGSSA Associate
                          • Oct 2006
                          • 6298

                          Originally posted by NeoWeird
                          I believe the pawn return is only for one the person who put it on consignment goes back in to get it. I overheard my FFL talking about it to someone and they were saying that it is a 30 day exempt transfer as well, so that if someone comes in with a dozen pistols and pawns them, they can return with the money and get them all back. Not sure as to all the details as I was only overhearing it, but I was interested and paying enough attention to catch that tidbit.

                          I've never done a consignment purchase, but chances are it's a new store with a new manager who is absolutely by the books the way he was trained and the other stores are either sloppy or he was misinformed. Seeing as it's the new Turners store, I'd chalk it up to the store and not the chain that is doing things differently than normal.
                          It is a new store, but it is (or was, as of opening day a couple of months ago)the same staff that's been at the Chino store forever. Unless they've made some recent staff changes, they should know how to handle transfers of any kind.
                          War is when your Government tells you who the enemy is......

                          Revolution is when you figure it out for yourself.

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                          • #14
                            Wild Bill
                            Member
                            • Feb 2004
                            • 285

                            I have made many gun purchases from the ChinoHills Turners and also when they were in Chino. I never had bit of trouble with new or consignment buys. They have always been strait with me and I would recommend them.
                            ________________________
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                            The Marine shrugged: "Recoil!"
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                            NRA Member and NRA Certified Rifle Instructor. Member of CRPA, GOA and SAF.

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