Pistol to Rifle Conversions

[Jel]

I searched to see if I could find any other posts about this here, and I couldn't find anything. My Search-Fu is weak!

I know this has been done before, even as far back as 50+ years ago, so the concept isn't new.

In any case, one of the latest ones comes from CAA Tactical who had a prototype come out in 2008.

https://www.proarms.cz/obrazy/novinky/Pistol_Rifle_Convertor.pdf

I saw this article this morning on Gizmodo.

http://gizmodo.com/5408961/pistol+rifle-converter-lets-your-pistol-dream-rifle-dreams

And Google searches found these.

http://www.mechtechsys.com/

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D99NHb6B03s

http://www.thefirearmblog.com/blog/2007/09/25/convert-a-glock-or-1911-pistol-into-a-carbine/

Will these ever see the light of day here in CA?

[djleisure]

I believe in this state that once you convert a pistol to a rifle you can NOT convert it back to pistol (excluding Thompson TC's.)

I'm sure someone will be along shortly with relevant PC and more info, however...

[Quiet]

Federally...

... once you make a handgun into a rifle, it will always be a rifle.

So, after you make a handgun into a rifle and you want to make it back into a handgun, you will need to get BATFE approval to make a SBR. To do so before you get approval, is making an illegal SBR (Federal felony).

In CA, you need to get Dangerous Weapons Permit from the CA DOJ BOF, before BATFE will approve a SBR.

[Jel]

But would this apply to these latest offerings where the handgun basically drops in place into the rifle's framework? In the CAA Tactical's case, the length of the barrel is not extended as I believe it's merely shooting though a secondary barrel/hole.

I can understand if the modifications to the handgun were semi-permanent to perm, but you can essentially convert back to a handgun in a few seconds without making any modifications to the handgun itself. It literally drops in and snaps together.

Is that mere fact alone, the act of dropping the handgun into a rifle-like framework, really make it a rifle or is is just a handgun shooting through some elaborate framework?

Not trying to debate or argue any issue here, just merely curious.

Thoughts?

[radioed22]

I asked the same question. The problem is that as soon as you add a stock to the hand gun that allows the weapon to be fired from the shoulder, it becomes a SBR. I want the H.E.R.A conversion for my Glock. The other thing would be let say you use the the longer barrel, now its a regular rifle and you would need a bullet button of some type for the Glock frame. If not it would be a detachable mag, assault weapon.

[ar15barrels]

Once a pistol, always a pistol so you can go back and forth between pistol and rifle as long as you observe the SBR rules.
A receiver that starts life as a rifle can never be made into a pistol or you would be in violation of SBR rules, even without a stock attached.

[Rukus]

I thought it was "once a rifle, always a rifle".

So Randall, following your info- You're saying that if I have an AR Pistol built and reg'd and then decide to swap uppers to a 16" and add a stock I could take that all off later and legally return it to its pistol state?

Wouldn't that then be creating an SBR?

[ar15barrels]

I thought it was "once a rifle, always a rifle".

So Randall, following your info- You're saying that if I have an AR Pistol built and reg'd and then decide to swap uppers to a 16" and add a stock I could take that all off later and legally return it to its pistol state?

Wouldn't that then be creating an SBR?

It's more like "FIRST a rifle, always a rifle".
It's also "FIRST a pistol, always a pistol".

That's how it works with a TC Contender per the court decision.

You install the 16"+ barrel BEFORE you install the shoulder stock.
Then when going the other way, you remove the shoulder stock BEFORE the 16"+ barrel.
That way you never make an SBR.

[Rukus]

IIRC isn't the TC specifically exempted from the legalities of converting back and forth?

An AR pistol would not fit this exemption. Otherwise what would stop people from just having one Pistol receiver and swapping uppers and stocks back and forth as necessary. Like a "all in one".

[ar15barrels]

what would stop people from just having one Pistol receiver and swapping uppers and stocks back and forth as necessary. Like a "all in one".

There's nothing stopping that.
You just have to purchase the receiver as a pistol to be able to do that.
You also need to heed the AW laws.

[Rukus]

Taken from Freakshow's letter to the ATF regarding pistol/rifle conversions.

Now I know that the certain TC's have been specifically exempted however doesnt Question 1 specifically address the pistol-rifle-pistol conversion?

[redcliff]

According to Freakshow doing the pistol to rifle back to pistol thing is risky. BATF's position is that only the TC was affected by the ruling.

That is true only with the TC Encore kit. Any other type is not covered under that case law and the ATF stance of once a rifle always a rifle stands.

http://www.calguns.net/calgunforum/showthread.php?p=1738692#post1738692

[Quiet]

Here's another BATFE NFA Branch letter.