Anti tank guns at ranges

[Rocklander97]

Anyone been to those full auto events and someone brings an anti tank gun. I?m curious how they find ammo for those things
Do they make it themselves or find someone that does it as a side gig ?


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[mycrstuff]

I have fired a Boys anti-tank rifle. The owner said it was converted from 55mm to 50 BMG due to laws and lack of ammo. You know those videos with a reporter complaining that that a AR-15 has massive recoil. Have him shoot one of those to learn what recoil really is.

[jchen76@gmail.com]

From the videos I've seen, owner will reload. They've mentioned that the original source was live surplus ammo back in the old days, pre 68 gun control act.

Deactivated ammo - if just the powder charge is removed, then just reload with minimum powder charge to keep brass in good condition. If brass has holes drilled into them, or crimped, they pull the projectile for use on good brass.

If all else is options are gone they just re-use the brass and create new projectiles out of steel/lead depending on projectile size on a lathe.

By far the brass is the most important component that can't be easily reproduced and they take care in making sure it's in good condition. Auto Eject on the bigger guns is usually disabled and powder charges are lower than original mil spec.

[Rocklander97]

From the videos I've seen, owner will reload. They've mentioned that the original source was live surplus ammo back in the old days, pre 68 gun control act.

Deactivated ammo - if just the powder charge is removed, then just reload with minimum powder charge to keep brass in good condition. If brass has holes drilled into them, or crimped, they pull the projectile for use on good brass.

If all else is options are gone they just re-use the brass and create new projectiles out of steel/lead depending on projectile size on a lathe.

By far the brass is the most important component that can't be easily reproduced and they take care in making sure it's in good condition. Auto Eject on the bigger guns is usually disabled and powder charges are lower than original mil spec.

Thank you for the info


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[audiophil2]

Depends on wallet size.
Most private owners reload and stay under 1/4oz explosive by using sub caliber conversion kits that allow the gun to for with 50bmg primers.

The big guys have type 10 FFL with FE license.
It's almost impossible to get that unless you live a distance from inhabited structures. About a minimum of 150ft of clearance around the explosive storage magazine.

You would be surprised where most cities store their explosives but it makes sense since it requires decent security and space. I've been in one in California blowing up duffle bags filled with apples.

[sigstroker]

In kali you pretty much have to get a sub-caliber conversion because you're not allowed to have Destructive Devices.

[Quiet]

In kali you pretty much have to get a sub-caliber conversion because you're not allowed to have Destructive Devices.

CA laws/regulations allows for the legal ownership/possession of Title 2 Destructive Device in CA for a person with a valid CA DOJ Dangerous Weapons Permit for DD. [PC 18900]

[SkyHawk]

I have fired a Boys anti-tank rifle. The owner said it was converted from 55mm 14mm to 50 BMG due to laws and lack of ammo. You know those videos with a reporter complaining that that a AR-15 has massive recoil. Have him shoot one of those to learn what recoil really is.

Fixed it. You were thinking 55 caliber or .55"

[sigstroker]

CA laws/regulations allows for the legal ownership/possession of Title 2 Destructive Device in CA for a person with a valid CA DOJ Dangerous Weapons Permit for DD. [PC 18900]

Right. Do you need two hands to count the number of people that have that?

[Quiet]

Right. Do you need two hands to count the number of people that have that?

Under CA laws/regulations, "collecting" is a valid good cause for issuance of a Dangerous Weapons Permit for a DD. [11 CCR 4128(c)(4)]

Per BATFE, as of 2021, there are 324,948 legally owned Title 2 DD in CA.




Penal Code 18900
(a) Every dealer, manufacturer, importer, and exporter of any destructive device, or any motion picture or television studio using destructive devices in the conduct of its business, shall obtain a permit for the conduct of that business from the Department of Justice.
(b) Any person, firm, or corporation not mentioned in subdivision (a) shall obtain a permit from the Department of Justice in order to possess or transport any destructive device. No permit shall be issued to any person who meets any of the following criteria:
(1) Has been convicted of any felony.
(2) Is addicted to the use of any narcotic drug.
(3) Is prohibited by state or federal law from possessing, receiving, owning, or purchasing a firearm.
(c) An application for a permit shall comply with all of the following:
(1) It shall be filed in writing.
(2) It shall be signed by the applicant if an individual, or by a member or officer qualified to sign if the applicant is a firm or corporation.
(3) It shall state the name, business in which engaged, business address, and a full description of the use to which the destructive devices are to be put.
(d) Applications and permits shall be uniform throughout the state on forms prescribed by the Department of Justice.

California Code of Regulations Title 11 Division 5 Chapter 7 Article 2 Section 4128
(a) Except as provided in sections 30900 through 30945, 31050, 31055, and 31100 of the Penal Code, no person shall possess, transport, or sell any dangerous weapon in this state unless they have been granted a license and/or permit pursuant to these regulations.
(b) No license or permit shall be issued to any applicant who fails to establish good cause for such license or permit and that such license or permit would not endanger the public safety.
(c) To establish good cause, an applicant must provide the DOJ with clear and convincing evidence that there is a bona fide market or public necessity for the issuance of a dangerous weapons license or permit and that the applicant can satisfy that need without endangering public safety. Except as provided by Penal Code section 33300, good causes recognized by the DOJ to establish a bona fide necessity for the issuance of licenses or permits includes the following:
(4) Possession for the purpose of maintaining a collection of destructive devices as defined in Penal Code section 16460 but such possession shall not be allowed for short-barreled shotguns, short-barreled rifles, machineguns or assault weapons.
(d) No license or permit shall be issued to any applicant who fails to comply with local zoning restrictions or local fire-protective services regulations or ordinances.
(e) The DOJ shall provide a notice of each license or permit issued to the Chief of Police or Sheriff having jurisdiction over the licensee or permittee's location. Copies of outstanding licenses and permits shall be provided to the Chief or Sheriff of jurisdiction upon request.

[smle-man]

I've seen WW2 era 57MM recoiless rifles subcalibered to .50BMG, a lot more affordable to shoot. Aren't rounds for greater than .50 considered DD in their own right?

[audiophil2]

I've seen WW2 era 57MM recoiless rifles subcalibered to .50BMG, a lot more affordable to shoot. Aren't rounds for greater than .50 considered DD in their own right?

Not always.
Depends on how much powder is used and projectile type.
Easy example is 20mm rifle. Rifle is DD but most cartridges are exempt from the $200 tax. A few cartridges have more than the 1/4 oz limit so it can be an issue.

Any cartridge with more than 4 ounces of propellent and/or 1/4oz explosive in the projectile requires $200 stamp.

Street sweeper is a DD but it's common shotgun ammo is not DD.

[CAL.BAR]

Under CA laws/regulations, "collecting" is a valid good cause for issuance of a Dangerous Weapons Permit for a DD. [11 CCR 4128(c)(4)]

Per BATFE, as of 2021, there are 324,948 legally owned Title 2 DD in CA.




Penal Code 18900
(a) Every dealer, manufacturer, importer, and exporter of any destructive device, or any motion picture or television studio using destructive devices in the conduct of its business, shall obtain a permit for the conduct of that business from the Department of Justice.
(b) Any person, firm, or corporation not mentioned in subdivision (a) shall obtain a permit from the Department of Justice in order to possess or transport any destructive device. No permit shall be issued to any person who meets any of the following criteria:
(1) Has been convicted of any felony.
(2) Is addicted to the use of any narcotic drug.
(3) Is prohibited by state or federal law from possessing, receiving, owning, or purchasing a firearm.
(c) An application for a permit shall comply with all of the following:
(1) It shall be filed in writing.
(2) It shall be signed by the applicant if an individual, or by a member or officer qualified to sign if the applicant is a firm or corporation.
(3) It shall state the name, business in which engaged, business address, and a full description of the use to which the destructive devices are to be put.
(d) Applications and permits shall be uniform throughout the state on forms prescribed by the Department of Justice.

California Code of Regulations Title 11 Division 5 Chapter 7 Article 2 Section 4128
(a) Except as provided in sections 30900 through 30945, 31050, 31055, and 31100 of the Penal Code, no person shall possess, transport, or sell any dangerous weapon in this state unless they have been granted a license and/or permit pursuant to these regulations.
(b) No license or permit shall be issued to any applicant who fails to establish good cause for such license or permit and that such license or permit would not endanger the public safety.
(c) To establish good cause, an applicant must provide the DOJ with clear and convincing evidence that there is a bona fide market or public necessity for the issuance of a dangerous weapons license or permit and that the applicant can satisfy that need without endangering public safety. Except as provided by Penal Code section 33300, good causes recognized by the DOJ to establish a bona fide necessity for the issuance of licenses or permits includes the following:
(4) Possession for the purpose of maintaining a collection of destructive devices as defined in Penal Code section 16460 but such possession shall not be allowed for short-barreled shotguns, short-barreled rifles, machineguns or assault weapons.
(d) No license or permit shall be issued to any applicant who fails to comply with local zoning restrictions or local fire-protective services regulations or ordinances.
(e) The DOJ shall provide a notice of each license or permit issued to the Chief of Police or Sheriff having jurisdiction over the licensee or permittee's location. Copies of outstanding licenses and permits shall be provided to the Chief or Sheriff of jurisdiction upon request.

Yeah we KNOW, but the law also says you can "theoretically" get an AW permit and a Standard Capacity Mag permit. We are trying to tell you that such licenses are virtually unheard of in CA unless you are in the movie business.

[sigstroker]

Not always.
Depends on how much powder is used and projectile type.
Easy example is 20mm rifle. Rifle is DD but most cartridges are exempt from the $200 tax. A few cartridges have more than the 1/4 oz limit so it can be an issue.

Any cartridge with more than 4 ounces of propellent and/or 1/4oz explosive in the projectile requires $200 stamp.

Street sweeper is a DD but it's common shotgun ammo is not DD.

Once upon a time I thought I wanted an M203 because I thought they were cool. I had probably just seen Scarface. I somehow found a dealer in them and the launchers and HE grenades were easy to get. After the usual NFA BS that is.

Shooting the grenades is a pain in the keester. You have to hire an eod to go with you because there are a lot of duds. Bad enough to pay $200 for a stamp for something that doesn't go boom, then afterward you have to file paperwork to de-list it from the NFA registry. I had too much money at the time and not enough sense, but thankfully the guy convinced me the fun quotient was too low.

[audiophil2]

Once upon a time I thought I wanted an M203 because I thought they were cool. I had probably just seen Scarface. I somehow found a dealer in them and the launchers and HE grenades were easy to get. After the usual NFA BS that is.

Shooting the grenades is a pain in the keester. You have to hire an eod to go with you because there are a lot of duds. Bad enough to pay $200 for a stamp for something that doesn't go boom, then afterward you have to file paperwork to de-list it from the NFA registry. I had too much money at the time and not enough sense, but thankfully the guy convinced me the fun quotient was too low.

My kid kept bugging me to get into the big stuff. I could buy 2 dds a year on my old SOT. After looking into the storage requirements I gave up. It's also extremely dangerous. A pistol or rifle blowing up can be deadly. I would not want to play with the big stuff. On my land ive blown up to 5lbs of tannerite at once. It's pretty much safe if you put it in very soft containers.
After playing with the real HE stuff with Santa Rosa eod I never really wanted to get into explosives. We used to mix a liquid HE based of a variant of nitromethane and another chemical. Just 2 ounces of it in a duffle bag full of apples would completely destroy everything and you felt the shockwave from 100yards like it was a 308 with a big compensator next to you. There explosive magazines had nothing near them for over 1000 yards except the apple trees.