Transporting/Using Freedom Week Mags

[benjamin101677]

Looking for any help on this. I'm not sure if it's been discussed as I couldn't find anything specifically on it.

If I go shooting and take a rifle with features and one without features, are there any issues with me having a 30-round freedom week magazine with me? I know you cannot put the 30 rounder in the rifle with features, but are there any issues with me having it?

IE; should I only take the 30-rounder when I only have the featureless rifle? Or as long as I'm not using the magazine in the featured rifle I'm okay?

My rifle bags have spots for magazines to sit in while transporting. If it's okay to have, is there any issues having them sitting in the same bag as the featured rifle? Or should I keep them somewhere else?

Might be a dumb question, but just want to make sure I'm okay and not falling into a gray area.

AR-15's and such are such a hot topic with California, etc. that I would just leave the freedom week magazines at home. Only you would need is some overjealous law enforcement officer to find you with the freedom week magazines and make a huge deal out of it. Yes, you may win in the end but is the headache worth the hassle?

I used to carry an AR-15 when I went fishing and a fish and game warden advised me that it probably wasn't a good idea as AR-15's are such a hot topic.

I would weigh the risk vs reward on the 30 round magazine and stick with the 10 round magazines to avoid any kind of issues or headaches

[champu]

AR-15's and such are such a hot topic with California, etc. that I would just leave the freedom week magazines at home. Only you would need is some overjealous law enforcement officer to find you with the freedom week magazines and make a huge deal out of it. Yes, you may win in the end but is the headache worth the hassle?

I used to carry an AR-15 when I went fishing and a fish and game warden advised me that it probably wasn't a good idea as AR-15's are such a hot topic.

I would weigh the risk vs reward on the 30 round magazine and stick with the 10 round magazines to avoid any kind of issues or headaches

[Librarian]

Thanks for posting that, champu.

Specifically:

However, there's a common saying, 'Do not argue the law at the side of the road'. Officer Friendly, even if s/he might be a lawyer, is, by profession and training and department policy, burdened with an interpretation of the law which guides enforcement. A LEO really will not care about pieces of paper you might be carrying; your lawyer, and through him/her the local DA, will care about the law.

[RickD427]

However, there's a common saying, 'Do not argue the law at the side of the road'. Officer Friendly, even if s/he might be a lawyer, is, by profession and training and department policy, burdened with an interpretation of the law which guides enforcement. A LEO really will not care about pieces of paper you might be carrying; your lawyer, and through him/her the local DA, will care about the law.

^^^^KINDA THIS^^^^

Librarian is right on point in that a LEO simply is not gonna debate the content and/or a person's interpretation of a law. And there are at least two good reasons for this: 1) A line-level officer is given the interpretation of the law they are expected to enforce. They don't get to put on a "Black Robe" and hold a trial to determine the issue. 2) Such dialogue never really comes to a successful conclusion.

We actually do care when folks try to bring legal points to out attention but we're about as suspicious and distrusting as we can be. I've seen too many documents that have been altered, counterfeited, or otherwise bamboozled to take any offered document as face value. But this is the digital age, and a lot of research can be done from a patrol car's computer. If an issue is respectfully raised, you should expect a diligent LEO to make an objective inquiry into your point.

[L4D]

However, there's a common saying, 'Do not argue the law at the side of the road'. Officer Friendly, even if s/he might be a lawyer, is, by profession and training and department policy, burdened with an interpretation of the law which guides enforcement. A LEO really will not care about pieces of paper you might be carrying; your lawyer, and through him/her the local DA, will care about the law.

^^^^KINDA THIS^^^^

Librarian is right on point in that a LEO simply is not gonna debate the content and/or a person's interpretation of a law. And there are at least two good reasons for this: 1) A line-level officer is given the interpretation of the law they are expected to enforce. They don't get to put on a "Black Robe" and hold a trial to determine the issue. 2) Such dialogue never really comes to a successful conclusion.

We actually do care when folks try to bring legal points to out attention but we're about as suspicious and distrusting as we can be. I've seen too many documents that have been altered, counterfeited, or otherwise bamboozled to take any offered document as face value. But this is the digital age, and a lot of research can be done from a patrol car's computer. If an issue is respectfully raised, you should expect a diligent LEO to make an objective inquiry into your point.

I'm not one to shove a document to a LEO. I understand what was said above.

How easy is it to check penal code from the patrol car?

Lets say PC 32310 was verbally provided are they able to verify the current injunction?

[champu]

^^^^KINDA THIS^^^^

Librarian is right on point in that a LEO simply is not gonna debate the content and/or a person's interpretation of a law. And there are at least two good reasons for this: 1) A line-level officer is given the interpretation of the law they are expected to enforce. They don't get to put on a "Black Robe" and hold a trial to determine the issue. 2) Such dialogue never really comes to a successful conclusion.

We actually do care when folks try to bring legal points to out attention but we're about as suspicious and distrusting as we can be. I've seen too many documents that have been altered, counterfeited, or otherwise bamboozled to take any offered document as face value. But this is the digital age, and a lot of research can be done from a patrol car's computer. If an issue is respectfully raised, you should expect a diligent LEO to make an objective inquiry into your point.

[RickD427]

I'm not one to shove a document to a LEO. I understand what was said above.

How easy is it to check penal code from the patrol car?

Lets say PC 32310 was verbally provided are they able to verify the current injunction?

Moist LEO's have relatively easy internet access from the field, either using their patrol car computer, or smart phone. Some agencies restrict access, but its still possible for a field officer to relay a request to their station desk.

The DOJ was required to send electronic notification to all peace officers of the injunction. Some LEO's would treat that as spam, some would relegate it to the back of their mind, and some will recall it. LEOs are human. But a respectfully made request for the order to be researched should be accepted, and that would produce a verifiable copy of the order.

So far I gotta think that the DOJ notification has been effective. California has more than 35,000 LEOs and I'm only aware of two instances where magazines were seized after the injunction was issued. No notification system is perfect, but this one is 99.9999% effective.

How hard do you want to work to stay out of the .0001%?

[L4D]

Moist LEO's have relatively easy internet access from the field, either using their patrol car computer, or smart phone. Some agencies restrict access, but its still possible for a field officer to relay a request to their station desk.

The DOJ was required to send electronic notification to all peace officers of the injunction. Some LEO's would treat that as spam, some would relegate it to the back of their mind, and some will recall it. LEOs are human. But a respectfully made request for the order to be researched should be accepted, and that would produce a verifiable copy of the order.

So far I gotta think that the DOJ notification has been effective. California has more than 35,000 LEOs and I'm only aware of two instances where magazines were seized after the injunction was issued. No notification system is perfect, but this one is 99.9999% effective.

How hard do you want to work to stay out of the .0001%?

Im about to make some "PC 32310" stickers and put the on my mags lol.

[champu]

Im about to make some "PC 32310" stickers and put the on my mags lol.

[L4D]

"Protected by injunction of PC 32310"

[ohsmily]

If an agency arrests for possession of a high cap mag, call me and/or FPC. Your legal fees MAY (may...no guaranty and I'm not making any assurance or guarantee nor could I as I'm not in a position to make those decisions) and it is also possible, if not likely, that an action could be brought against the agency. LE agencies have received notice from the DOJ regarding the injunction and this is not a new issue. If they arrest on possession of a high cap mag, it is incompetent and arguably a violation of your rights.

[thedrickel]

But they can still be confiscated under the nuisance language, correct?

[RickD427]

But they can still be confiscated under the nuisance language, correct?

As a purely technical matter, yes they can still be seized under the "Nuisance" statute, but don't look for that to happen. Below are comments that I posted in the other thread on this same subject:

It is quite interesting that Judge Benitez did not include the nuisance provision in his injunction. But he did address it in his original opinion. LE agencies tend to be very respectful of the federal courts, and are not going to act in a manner that would likely offend the court while an issue is before it.

There have only been two seizures of Large-Capacity Magazines that I am aware of following the issuance of the injunction. Neither case made it to trial (although one did go to a prelim). And I understand that magazines were returned in both cases.

In neither case did the LE agency pursue a "Nuisance" seizure of the involved magazines.

[Jimi Jah]

My legal 30's and 20's are kept at home where they could be of the most use.

Always use 10's outside the home. I'd rather fly under the radar.

[ohsmily]

My legal 30's and 20's are kept at home where they could be of the most use.

Always use 10's outside the home. I'd rather fly under the radar.

To each their own based on their risk tolerance. I have no hesitation to use all magazines that I own outside the home irrespective of capacity.