Selling a gun - Form 4546 ?

[Big_Ned]

For the first time in my life I am thinking about selling a gun (my Ruger Mini 14). I have seen some of the threads here on CGN about the how-to of selling. One question I still have is in regard to the DOJ BOF Form 4546 "Notice of No Longer in Possession." If I do a F2F cash sale with the buyer at a facilitating licensed FFL I know the DROS and state fees will be handled by the FFL, but what about the Form 4546? I guess my concern is that once the gun leaves my possession I don't want the DOJ (which has a record of me buying the gun) thinking I still possess it. So who is responsible for filing the Form 4546, the FFL, or me? Many thanks in advance for your knowledgeable replies. - Big_Ned.

[edgerly779]

overkill and paranoia.

[Big_Ned]

It is no doubt a sucky law, but I don't want to be on the wrong side of it...

[edgerly779]

You do not need to notify anyone. Keep a copy of dros . I do as seller and as buyer.

[BONECUTTER]

When you sell a gun via PPT the CADOJ registers that serial number to the new owner. You are still listed as the owner of that serial number unless you do a NLIP form.

This is normally a non issue but every once in a while I see people get a firearms ownership report, only to see many firearms still listed to them.

I've seen restraining orders with firearms ownership records they don't have and need to explain to the courts.

They only way is could really be bad is if the dealer does not deliver in the state system to the new owner by accident.

[Big_Ned]

Thanks edgerly779 and BONECUTTER both for the replies. So if I am understanding this correctly, I am not obliged to file the NLIP (Form 4546), and simply keeping a copy of the DROS from the sale in my own records should be sufficient under normal circumstances. However, there are some minority of cases that occasionally come up where a person's 2A rights are being legally challenged (for example by a restraining order) in which the DOJ will still ascribe ownership to a person that no longer owns those firearms, and in those situations it is a real PITA to get the record corrected. Do I have that right?

[USMCM16A2]

I do the 4546 when I sell a firearm to an out of state buyer. I always go through a California FFL to do the transfer. If possible I get a copy of the FFL of the purchaser, and make copies. I make sure I have the name and address and phone number of the purchaser, as well as the FFL. I fill out the form, and staple copies of relevant paperwork. Be sure to stay under the firearms sale limits. A2

[Librarian]

Since the DROS process adds the new owner to AFS - doesn't delete the record for the prior owner, though - no need for the NLIP for an in-CA, properly-through-an-FFL sale.

Look at the form; ask your non-CA buyer if s/he is happy to give that info to CA DOJ.

[Big_Ned]

Thank you USMCM16A2 and Librarian. What I hear you both saying is that the 4546 NLIP probably should be filed if the gun is going to a buyer that is out of state, but for an in state sale handled properly through a FFL it is not necessary because the DROS serves to inform the CA DOJ of the transfer of ownership. Do I have that right?

[Big_Ned]

BTW, I really do appreciate the information here, coming as it does from more experienced people than myself. Thank you one and all!

[Librarian]

Thank you USMCM16A2 and Librarian. What I hear you both saying is that the 4546 NLIP probably should be filed if the gun is going to a buyer that is out of state, but for an in state sale handled properly through a FFL it is not necessary because the DROS serves to inform the CA DOJ of the transfer of ownership. Do I have that right?

DROS covers CA, yes.

For myself, I would not ever file the NLIP.

[ar15barrels]

For the first time in my life I am thinking about selling a gun (my Ruger Mini 14). I have seen some of the threads here on CGN about the how-to of selling. One question I still have is in regard to the DOJ BOF Form 4546 "Notice of No Longer in Possession." If I do a F2F cash sale with the buyer at a facilitating licensed FFL I know the DROS and state fees will be handled by the FFL, but what about the Form 4546? I guess my concern is that once the gun leaves my possession I don't want the DOJ (which has a record of me buying the gun) thinking I still possess it. So who is responsible for filing the Form 4546, the FFL, or me? Many thanks in advance for your knowledgeable replies. - Big_Ned.

Once the PPT DROS is closed out, the gun is registered to the new owner.
If the gun were to be used in a crime and left at the scene, the police are going to go to the new owner.

The report of no-longer-in-possession is for when you sell a gun outside of CA.
Since the gun would go to an FFL outside of CA, the FFL in any other state is not going to register the gun to it's new owner for the CADOJ.
Hence the form to let them know that you no longer posses the gun.

[Big_Ned]

Ok! That clears up my confusion on this. Thank you again one and all who responded. It is very much appreciated!