PPT Limit & Consignments

[BigD6765]

Okay, it is clear to me that we have the PPT limit of 5 transactions (max 50 guns).

I was told by a dealer that we can consign guns and aren't subject to the PPT limits....which got me thinking.

Some of the consignment fees are relatively high...I've heard anywhere from 20-40%. But, if I bring a buyer in...put the guns on consignment, the buyer buys said guns immediately from the dealer...do you think a dealer would lower the fee since it's "all in one fell swoop" so to speak.

They are subject to a 30 day hold (pawn shop rules) and I'm not 100% clear if there's a 10 day wait on top of that. So, it would take longer. But, has anyone gone down this route before?

[sfe187]

I highly doubt it but everything is negotiable. If you find the buyer yourself, why not just take your gun back and do PPT after (depend on how long contract was on consignment). But if you feel like you gonna lose the buyer and want ppt right away, your gun sat and used FFL's storage n shelves space I would think that FFL wants some sorts compensation.

[????? ????]

A consignment sale is actually considered a PPT. Which is why you see lots of off-rosters being consigned.

[ACfixer]

Related question... is the 5 transactions set in stone?

What would happen if someone did 6, are they actually breaking a law or would the DROS be denied perhaps?

[jsigone]

6th one needs a dealer license and state wants you to pay taxes on the guns you sold.

[ACfixer]

6th one needs a dealer license and state wants you to pay taxes on the guns you sold.

Understood, but how would the FFL doing the transfer have any clue that was your 6th unless you did them all at the same place? Just curiosity. And what taxes? It could be a trade for all they know.

I'm a square, I don't break laws... and I'm leaving the state but I am just wondering how they enforce that if anyone knows.

[Mike512usa]

Understood, but how would the FFL doing the transfer have any clue that was your 6th unless you did them all at the same place? Just curiosity. And what taxes? It could be a trade for all they know.

I'm a square, I don't break laws... and I'm leaving the state but I am just wondering how they enforce that if anyone knows.

I suspect they most likely won't know BUT if they find out the penalty can be rather harsh and there will be NO compassion. I say it is not worth the risk.

[sheepdawg]

Has anyone heard of a prosecution for having done too many PPTs? I mean there’s the cases of police officers flipping off-rosters but those are always federal cases of selling without a license because they’re selling dozens of off-rosters repeatedly. It’s probably a boogeyman just like 18 USC 922(r) compliance for the end-user.

[Spaffo]

Is the consignment considered 1 transaction, regardless of the number of guns in the consignment to the LGS?

[ACfixer]

I suspect they most likely won't know BUT if they find out the penalty can be rather harsh and there will be NO compassion. I say it is not worth the risk.

Based on? Is there an actual statute and penalties assigned to it?

I'm not going to do it, I am leaving this wretched state and won't have to play in the kiddie pool anymore... but I am just wondering the same as sheepdawg:

Has anyone heard of a prosecution for having done too many PPTs?

This.

[BigD6765]

I was told by a dealer...take it for what it's worth...that it's not likely they'll get up in arms if you go 6 or 7 now and then....but if you do go out and sell a bunch (whatever "bunch" is)...they will likely look at all your sales with a critical eye. This particular dealer hadn't known anyone that was prosecuted for the "beyond 5" rule, with the exception of the various law enforcement folks that have wound up in the papers from time to time.

To clarify a couple of the earlier comments...

One, I'm asking if a person wanted to / needed to sell more than the allotted 5, it seems like selling them via consignment allows that to happen. IE, consignment is not considered the same as a PPT (although it does transfer more like PPT than a sale). And Two, has anyone had success negotiating the fee for consignment if you bring the buyer to the dealer yourself.

[heidad01]

From what I have read and understand, the limit is placed so that people don't start gun dealerships at home and run a business of buying and selling guns without a dealer's license.

Now if you fall in hard times and need to sell all 6, 7, or 12 of your guns in the same year, nobody cares. You can sell your property if you need/want to.

That is, nobody cares so long as you don't make it a habit of falling in hard times every year and selling a bunch over that limit.

Not a lawyer and this is not legal advice.

[concerned gun owner]

This pertains to ammo but is there a limit on how much you can sell ?

[vino68]

Has anyone heard of a prosecution for having done too many PPTs? I mean there’s the cases of police officers flipping off-rosters but those are always federal cases of selling without a license because they’re selling dozens of off-rosters repeatedly. It’s probably a boogeyman just like 18 USC 922(r) compliance for the end-user.

Several. Two were LEOs abusing their off roster status. That prompted the change to the law. One was an LT ( I recall) from Pasadena PD. The other was a LEO for an alphabet agency out of Santa Fe Springs, I recall. Both raids where covered here on Calguns and local media and included ATF.

[code_blue]

I'm pretty sure that yall are giving our overlords a little too much credit.