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  • neffect
    Member
    • Apr 2013
    • 118

    Is this an AOW?

    Is this an AOW or just a "Pistol" in CA? Since CA sees everything under 16" barrel as a pistol. Federal this would be and AOW, but where does it fall in CA?

  • #2
    norcalAF
    CGN/CGSSA Contributor
    CGN Contributor
    • Jul 2012
    • 1654

    I can't speak to the legalities, but the cool factor is pretty high!

    Comment

    • #3
      The War Wagon
      I need a LIFE!!
      • Apr 2011
      • 10294

      Better send it to me for safekeeping, while your legalities are straightened out.
      sigpic

      Comment

      • #4
        Milsurp1
        Veteran Member
        • Aug 2016
        • 3091

        The vertical device in front is the tripod it is mounted on, not a vertical handgrip, so why would it be an AOW federally?

        Comment

        • #5
          neffect
          Member
          • Apr 2013
          • 118

          My understanding....

          Federally:
          - Barrel is under 16" so its a pistol
          - BUT its not designed to be fired with one hand or have a pistol grip = AOW
          - If it was over 26" inches is would be a "Firearm", but still has no pistol grip. Not sure what happens there. ???

          CA
          - Barrel is under 16", so its a pistol.

          Comment

          • #6
            Mandingo27
            Senior Member
            • Dec 2017
            • 776

            That's pretty neat

            Comment

            • #7
              plumbum
              Calguns Addict
              • May 2010
              • 5394

              I’ve seen rifles with the spade trigger, but not a pistol before... hmm this could be interesting.
              Originally posted by ysr_racer
              Please don't bring logic and reason into an interwebs discussion

              Comment

              • #8
                enorbit3
                Veteran Member
                • Oct 2011
                • 2653

                Doesn't Franklin armory make something like that for CA?
                LAPD CCW Timeline:
                Application Sent/Rec'd - 10/11/22
                Interview Scheduled - 2/20/22
                Interview & Live Scan- 2/21/22
                DOJ/FBI - 2/22/23
                CCW Training - 2/25/23
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                LAPD CCW Approval Call - 3/20/23
                CCW Permit Issued/picked up - 4/11/23

                Comment

                • #9
                  sigstroker
                  I need a LIFE!!
                  • Jan 2009
                  • 19572

                  Originally posted by neffect
                  My understanding....

                  Federally:
                  - Barrel is under 16" so its a pistol
                  - BUT its not designed to be fired with one hand or have a pistol grip = AOW
                  - If it was over 26" inches is would be a "Firearm", but still has no pistol grip. Not sure what happens there. ???

                  CA
                  - Barrel is under 16", so its a pistol.
                  It has a rifled barrel.

                  Comment

                  • #10
                    SCVlongstroke
                    Senior Member
                    • Jan 2018
                    • 725

                    If it even seems cool then it’s not California legal

                    Comment

                    • #11
                    • #12
                      Quiet
                      retired Goon
                      • Mar 2007
                      • 30241

                      Originally posted by neffect
                      Is this an AOW or just a "Pistol" in CA? Since CA sees everything under 16" barrel as a pistol. Federal this would be and AOW, but where does it fall in CA?

                      Under Federal laws/regulations...

                      Because the lengths are unknown, don't know if it is a Title 1 Other or a Title 2 AOW.

                      Firearm + barrel length less than 16" + overall length less than 26" + no shoulder stock = Title 1 Handgun.
                      Firearm + barrel length less than 16" + overall length less than 26" + no shoulder stock + vertical forward grip or smoothbore barrel = Title 2 AOW.
                      Firearm + barrel length less than 16" + overall length greater than 26" + no shoulder stock = Title 1 Other.
                      Firearm + barrel length greater than 16" + overall length greater than 26" + no shoulder stock = Title 1 Other


                      Under Ca laws/regulations...

                      Firearm with a less than 16" barrel length is a "handgun", which can also be a SBR/SBS if it meets those definitions.

                      A semi-auto pistol that is not listed on the Roster of Handguns Certified for Sale and does not have a chamber load indicator, magazine disconnect mechanism, and microstamping array is an unsafe handgun.

                      Semi-auto pistol that accepts magazines outside of it's grip is an assault weapon.

                      Title 2 AOW are exempt from CA SBR/SBS laws, but are not exempt from CA assault weapons laws and CA unsafe handgun laws.


                      Therefore...

                      The firearm as pictured would be considered a handgun, unsafe handgun, and assault weapon.


                      Originally posted by enorbit3
                      Doesn't Franklin armory make something like that for CA?
                      Franklin Armory made a CA legal Title 1 Other version that was semi-auto centerfire that did not have a fixed magazine and had a barrel length of greater than 16" + overall length greater than 30" + no shoulder stock + spade grip + bipod/tripod mount.
                      Last edited by Quiet; 02-24-2020, 5:45 PM.
                      sigpic

                      "If someone has a gun and is trying to kill you, it would be reasonable to shoot back with your own gun." - Dalai Lama (Seattle Times, 05-15-2001).

                      Comment

                      • #13
                        neffect
                        Member
                        • Apr 2013
                        • 118

                        Originally posted by Quiet
                        Under Federal laws/regulations...

                        Because the lengths are unknown, don't know if it is a Title 1 Other or a Title 2 AOW.

                        Firearm + barrel length less than 16" + overall length less than 26" + no shoulder stock = Title 1 Handgun.
                        Firearm + barrel length less than 16" + overall length less than 26" + no shoulder stock + vertical forward grip or smoothbore barrel = Title 2 AOW.
                        Firearm + barrel length less than 16" + overall length greater than 26" + no shoulder stock = Title 1 Other.
                        Firearm + barrel length greater than 16" + overall length greater than 26" + no shoulder stock = Title 1 Other


                        Under Ca laws/regulations...

                        Firearm with a less than 16" barrel length is a "handgun", which can also be a SBR/SBS if it meets those definitions.

                        A semi-auto pistol that is not listed on the Roster of Handguns Certified for Sale and does not have a chamber load indicator, magazine disconnect mechanism, and microstamping array is an unsafe handgun.

                        Semi-auto pistol that accepts magazines outside of it's grip is an assault weapon.

                        Title 2 AOW are exempt from CA SBR/SBS laws, but are not exempt from CA assault weapons laws and CA unsafe handgun laws.


                        Therefore...

                        The firearm as pictured would be considered a handgun, unsafe handgun, and assault weapon.

                        Franklin Armory made a CA legal Title 1 Other version that was semi-auto centerfire that did not have a fixed magazine and had a barrel length of greater than 16" + overall length greater than 30" + no shoulder stock + spade grip + bipod/tripod mount.
                        Ok QUITE.

                        Lower is register BBAW or AW as a Pistol.
                        Barrel is under 16"
                        Overall length is under 26" (But it might be 26"+, dont think that matters)

                        I'm staying Pistol. (AW or BBAW) QUITE is that correct?

                        Comment

                        • #14
                          Quiet
                          retired Goon
                          • Mar 2007
                          • 30241

                          Originally posted by neffect
                          Lower is register BBAW or AW as a Pistol.
                          Barrel is under 16"
                          Overall length is under 26" (But it might be 26"+, dont think that matters)

                          I'm staying Pistol. (AW or BBAW) QUITE is that correct?
                          If it is a RAW, then it would take care of the issue of being an assault weapon.

                          Since it was already transferred or registered as a semi-auto pistol, then it would take care of the issue of being an unsafe handgun.

                          Since the barrel length is less than 16", then it would still be considered a handgun.
                          Last edited by Quiet; 02-24-2020, 6:09 PM.
                          sigpic

                          "If someone has a gun and is trying to kill you, it would be reasonable to shoot back with your own gun." - Dalai Lama (Seattle Times, 05-15-2001).

                          Comment

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