Legality of Ak thordsen stock?

[9mmrevolver]

Reason I ask is there is a silent auction for 50 bucks. Seems like the grasp is well below the action of the receiver

[boopiejones]

looks Like it would not be legal to me. The AR version looks legal, but the AK version is essentially the AR version with an adapter plate that goes between the stock and receiver. Problem is that the adapter allows the webbing of the hand to be below the trigger and therefore not legal (in my very un-lawyery opinion)

[mnichols]

What?
If it's legal on an AR, it s legal on an AK.
The position of the web of the hand is irrelevant because it's not a grip, it's a stock.

[baih777]

What?
If it's legal on an AR, it s legal on an AK.
The position of the web of the hand is irrelevant because it's not a grip, it's a stock.

^^^^^^^^^^ this

[ACfixer]

Let me premise this by saying I think everything should be legal, hand grenades and sub-machineguns included. With that in mind we're talking about California and I'm not sure I'd want to pay the legal fees associated with arguing this isn't a thumbhole stock. Yes, I get it the top is open so it's not a "hole" but it certainly allows a similar grip. If the top was connected it would be a thumbhole stock without question.

[boopiejones]

What?
If it's legal on an AR, it s legal on an AK.
The position of the web of the hand is irrelevant because it's not a grip, it's a stock.

It’s a grip/stock combo. The concern is whether the grip portion may still be considered a “pistol grip”

5469 (d) "pistol grip that protrudes conspicuously beneath the action of the weapon" means a grip that allows for a pistol style grasp in which the web of the trigger hand (between the thumb and index finger) can be placed below the top of the exposed portion of the trigger while firing.

On an AR15, the thordsen does not allow the web of the hand to be placed below the top portion of the trigger. But on an AK47, the the thordsen stock DOES allow the web to be below the top of the trigger.

[Dirk Tungsten]

Let me premise this by saying I think everything should be legal, hand grenades and sub-machineguns included. With that in mind we're talking about California and I'm not sure I'd want to pay the legal fees associated with arguing this isn't a thumbhole stock. Yes, I get it the top is open so it's not a "hole" but it certainly allows a similar grip. If the top was connected it would be a thumbhole stock without question.

Ha ha holy cow, that's totally a thumbhole stock. OP there's no way you should even chance using that thing in CA. Google search "AK thumbhole stock" and you'll see multiple examples of how similar the 2 are.

[IVC]

The position of the web of the hand is irrelevant because it's not a grip, it's a stock.

Pistol grip is a "feature" in CA legal sense and it is defined based on hand position relative to trigger.

It doesn't matter whether pistol grip is part of the stock or not. If you can hold it certain way, it's a pistol grip. Thordsen is playing very close to the legal line with their stocks. Anyone using one should understand potential legal implications.

[Unbekannt]

Pistol grip is a "feature" in CA legal sense and it is defined based on hand position relative to trigger.

It doesn't matter whether pistol grip is part of the stock or not. If you can hold it certain way, it's a pistol grip. Thordsen is playing very close to the legal line with their stocks. Anyone using one should understand potential legal implications.

This was my point about the AR version. That version may function as a stock but it has a pistol grip built into it.

[Thordo]

Pistol grip is a "feature" in CA legal sense and it is defined based on hand position relative to trigger.

It doesn't matter whether pistol grip is part of the stock or not. If you can hold it certain way, it's a pistol grip. Thordsen is playing very close to the legal line with their stocks. Anyone using one should understand potential legal implications.

Have you read the new AW regulations? A "pistol grip" is a standalone feature as is a "rifle stock". They have completely different definitions in the new regs and are not related.

Thordo

[Thordo]

This was my point about the AR version. That version may function as a stock but it has a pistol grip built into it.

We've been selling the FRS in CA for 7 years now (somewhere around 50,000 units) and there hasn't been a single person arrested or detained for possession of an AW BECAUSE OF our stock. If there ever was we would be the first to know.

Thordo

[Thordo]

Ha ha holy cow, that's totally a thumbhole stock. OP there's no way you should even chance using that thing in CA. Google search "AK thumbhole stock" and you'll see multiple examples of how similar the 2 are.

Again, have you read the AW regulations? A "Thumbhole stock" is VERY clearly defined. There is no "hole" in the "stock for your thumb to pass through while firing.

[IVC]

Have you read the new AW regulations? A "pistol grip" is a standalone feature as is a "rifle stock". They have completely different definitions in the new regs and are not related.

Thordo

Please post a link/reference to the specific penal code section or regulation that you are referencing.

Every "compliance stock" is based on the location of the webbing of the hand relative to the top of the trigger, not on any distinction between grip and stock. Otherwise, one would take a standard pistol grip and extend stock from the bottom of it - think of Thordsen stock with much more pronounced angle of the grip.

Disclosure: I own a few Thordsen stocks and use them, together with a few CQR stocks. I am personally comfortable about legal status, but if I were to recommend them to someone, I would make sure they understand where the limit is being pushed.

[boopiejones]

Again, have you read the AW regulations? A "Thumbhole stock" is VERY clearly defined. There is no "hole" in the "stock for your thumb to pass through while firing.

I don’t think the thumbhole stock is the issue here. I think it’s the pistol grip. Your stock looks fine on an AR, but it looks like it is still technically a pistol grip when installed on an AK, as the webbing of the hand sits below the top of the visible part of the trigger.

I don’t think the thordsen stock could be used to make a featureless AK.

[Unbekannt]

We've been selling the FRS in CA for 7 years now (somewhere around 50,000 units) and there hasn't been a single person arrested or detained for possession of an AW BECAUSE OF our stock. If there ever was we would be the first to know.

Thordo

Thordo, I'm not against you or your product. I am just apprehensive. The information you posted is good to know.