Gun transfer question

[dusty]

I have a friend who wants to sell me a handgun and shotgun that belonged to her husband. The husband passed away a few months ago. Can she transfer the guns or does she need to have the guns put in her name first. I checked the DOJ website but could not find any information. Thanks in advance for your help.

[Librarian]

Presuming both she and her husband were residents of CA, she probably would have had the guns as surviving spouse, and a punctilious executor would have executed an Operation of Law transfer for the handgun (or, all the handguns if more than one). Even though late-ish, that still would be a good idea. The shotgun needs no paper.

At this point she can just sell you the shotgun - go to an FFL and do a private party transaction. Once the Operation of Law form is filed, she can do the same with the handgun.

Since the DOJ puts a low priority on those Oplaw forms, it could be several months before an acknowledgement appears, but it would look odd to see a DROS on handgun X in March, followed by an Oplaw form for the same handgun to the seller in the March transaction.

Neatness counts.

[dusty]

I called two different FFL's today. One said she could transfer the gun to me without anything else because she retained ownership upon her husband's death. The other one said she might need to do an inter family transfer first, but he is not sure. Which one is right?

[Librarian]

I called two different FFL's today. One said she could transfer the gun to me without anything else because she retained ownership upon her husband's death. The other one said she might need to do an inter family transfer first, but he is not sure. Which one is right?

Both.

The first one is right (almost certainly) but incomplete. Unlike a lot of other personal property, handguns in CA have some additional formalities. The wife would ordinarily (there are some exceptions, but let's ignore them) have owned the guns as community property; on the death of her husband, community property does go to the wife.

The formality is that Operation of Law form (it's also used for intrafamily transfer) that the second FFL mentioned. (Similar formalities happen with things that are taxed - cars and boats, real property - at some point the name on the ownership might need to be changed.)

Suppose, for discussion, she wanted to keep the handgun and shoot it and otherwise legally use it. As a practical matter, she would be fine - she really does own it. (She really should also get a handgun Safety Certificate.)

It's only where transfer outside the family comes in that establishing precise ownership is an issue. It would be better (neater) if the chain of title clearly went from Husband Q. Jones to Wife T. Jones, via the OpLaw form, and then to Dusty Buyer in the PPT.

Wife Jones files the paper with $19, saying she received the handgun as community property as surviving spouse; state twitches the data base to substitute in Wife T., in place of Husband Q., and sends back a letter (in its own sweet time) verifying the change.

On the other hand, if the estate is still not completely settled, and she is acting as executor, I believe it is that case that she can dispose of the property without the OpLaw form and without the HSC.

[bruceflinch]

I bought 2 guns from my neighbor widow 2 yrs ago. Regular PPT.