Ammo question...

[ghsdca]

To start, I've read and signed the petitions for the upcoming bills but I'm unclear on one thing in particular. I've noticed that many are stocking ammo at this point and I'm wondering if that directly to relates to possible upcoming ammo background checks and/or quantity limitations (plus ammo background check registration fees). I buy online in bulk and am trying to determine if this method is in jeopardy come 1/1/17. Nevertheless, I'm stocking up. Feedback is appreciated!

[HighWildFree]

Well if you read the bills you'd know that online sales are going to end. Ammo, is much cheaper online. Which means, buy it now for cheap, or later for much more and none of the convenience.

Your whole post seems rather trolling though.

[ghsdca]

Here's to a great start of this thread! Trolling? I guess I should have known better than to ask an honest question. Shame, shame on me. I was under the impression. That online, out of state sales may still be allowable if received by local, in state FFL with proper credentials.

[Hairball]

They will at this point but many would rather get as much as they can before all of your information is collected every time you make a purchase.

[Scratch705]

Here's to a great start of this thread! Trolling? I guess I should have known better than to ask an honest question. Shame, shame on me. I was under the impression. That online, out of state sales may still be allowable if received by local, in state FFL with proper credentials.

yes, but with that, the in state FFL can charge a fee for accepting that shipment, and who knows if they are allowed to charge additional fees like storage fees thus making the act of buying online more expensive or as expensive as buying in state.

and i'm willing to bet that the BOE will jump on this and force the FFL to collect sales tax on those ammo like they do now with out of state guns being shipped in state.

[Nick Justice]

The ammo law is supposed to kick in on 1/1/19

Whatever you want, get it now. Also get watertight containers and a shovel.

[DesertDave100]

I imagine the costs of buying ammo on-line, through the legal means in the new law, will impose costs similar to what you find when you try to purchase a firearm on-line today. The state fees and the fees the FFL take as part of doing their business adds another $100 or so to the firearm cost, not counting sales tax.

It will significantly raise the cost of shooting, for those who shoot ammo in the $.25 to $40 a round arena. If you are buying ammo at $1.25 a round then you may not feel the cost increase so much.

One would think that a 'progressive' establishment would not choose to implement such regressive costs, but that's an oxymoron. I used 'think' and 'progressive' in the same sentence.

[swiss_]

I imagine the costs of buying ammo on-line, through the legal means in the new law, will impose costs similar to what you find when you try to purchase a firearm on-line today. The state fees and the fees the FFL take as part of doing their business adds another $100 or so to the firearm cost, not counting sales tax.

It will significantly raise the cost of shooting, for those who shoot ammo in the $.25 to $40 a round arena. If you are buying ammo at $1.25 a round then you may not feel the cost increase so much.

One would think that a 'progressive' establishment would not choose to implement such regressive costs, but that's an oxymoron. I used 'think' and 'progressive' in the same sentence.

[onelonehorseman]

I was under the impression. That online, out of state sales may still be allowable if received by local, in state FFL with proper credentials.

True, but don't expect the middleman FFL to do that for free. Again, it won't be cheaper than it is now.

[edgerly779]

Yes still allowed and lots of posts on this. Cabelas has 22lr today for 2.99 for 50 and 10$ off on hundred buck sale. I am buying 22lr and some

[onelonehorseman]

Another thing to consider . . . (get your tin foil hats on now) . . is that if Hilary lands in the White house, she WILL go after military type weapons AND most likely the NATO type ammunition that feeds them. In the debate last night, she even mention that military style weapons should not be available to civis (don't remember the exact quote but it was directly to that effect).

This could potentially begin even before the ammo bill takes affect on 1-1-18

So prepare or not, it's up to you.

[billped]

To summarize the price increases and other concerns:
* sales tax charged by local FFL
* handling fee charged by local FFL (this could be huge)
* gas and time to go to local FFL
* some FFLs won't want to deal with it, leading to hassle plus higher costs
* some Internet sellers won't want to deal with it, fewer sellers equals higher prices
* notification to the State of California

Anything else?

[bsg]

buy more ammo.

[onelonehorseman]

To summarize the price increases and other concerns:
* sales tax charged by local FFL
* handling fee charged by local FFL (this could be huge)
* gas and time to go to local FFL
* some FFLs won't want to deal with it, leading to hassle plus higher costs
* some Internet sellers won't want to deal with it, fewer sellers equals higher prices
* notification to the State of California

Anything else?

I thought I read something about a CADOJ annual fee for the ammo card?

[Sousuke]

yes, but with that, the in state FFL can charge a fee for accepting that shipment, and who knows if they are allowed to charge additional fees like storage fees thus making the act of buying online more expensive or as expensive as buying in state.

and i'm willing to bet that the BOE will jump on this and force the FFL to collect sales tax on those ammo like they do now with out of state guns being shipped in state.

I realize this may not have spread beyond the Curio Relic forum yet, but there is an exemption for an FFL 03 with a COE.

The question will be...will online sellers be willing to keep people's licenses and COE on file.

We know some will not because of how they deal with ammo already. I think alot of the smaller companies will though like SGAmmo, maybe AIMSurplus because they already keep licenses on file etc.

Relevant text below:

Section 30312 of the Penal Code is amended to read:
30312. (a) Commencing February 1, 2011, the (1) Commencing January 1, 2018, the sale of
ammunition by any party shall be conducted by or processed through a licensed ammunition
vendor.
14
Arndt.
(2) When neither party to an ammunition sale is a licensed ammunition vendor, the seller shall
deliver the ammunition to a vendor to process the transaction. The ammunition vendor shall then
promptly and properly deliver the ammunition to the purchaser, if the sale is not prohibited, as if
the ammunition were the vendor's own merchandise. If the ammunition vendor cannot legally
deliver the ammunition to the purchaser, the vendor shall forthwith return the ammunition to the
seller. The ammunition vendor may charge the purchaser an administrative fee to process the
transaction, in an amount to be set by the Department of Justice, in addition to any applicable
fees that may be charged pursuant to the provisions of this title.
(b) Commencing January 1, 2018, the sale, delivery or transfer of ownership of handgun
ammunition by any party may only occur in a face-to-face transaction with the seller, deliverer or
transferor being provided bona fide evidence of identity from the purchaser or other transferee~
provided, however, that ammunition may be purchased or acquired over the Internet or through
other means of remote ordering if a licensed ammunition vendor initially receives the
ammunition and processes the transaction in compliance with this section and Article 3
(commencing with Section 30342) of Chapter 1 of Division 10 of Title 4 of this part.
tbf.(Ql_Subdivision~ (a) and (b) shall not apply to or affect the sale, delivery, or transfer of
handgun ammunition to any of the following:
(1) An authorized law enforcement representative of a city, county, city and county, or state or
federal government, if the sale, delivery, or transfer is for exclusive use by that government
agency and, prior to the sale, delivery, or transfer of the handgun ammunition, written
authorization from the head of the agency employing the purchaser or transferee is obtained,
identifying the employee as an individual authorized to conduct the transaction, and authorizing
the transaction for the exclusive use of the agency employing the individual.
(2) A sworn peace officer, as defined in Chapter 4.5 ( commencing with Section 830) of Title 3 of
Part 2, or sworn federal law enforcement officer, who is authorized to carry a firearm in the
course and scope of the officer's duties.
(3) An importer or manufacturer of handgun ammunition or firearms who is licensed to engage
in business pursuant to Chapter 44 ( commencing with Section 921) of Title 18 of the United
States Code and the regulations issued pursuant thereto.
( 4) A person who is on the centralized list of exempted federal firearms licensees maintained by
the Department of Justice pursuant to Article 6 (commencing with Section 28450) of Chapter 6
of Division 6 of this title.
(5) A person whose licensed premises are outside this state and who is licensed as a dealer or
collector of firearms pursuant to Chapter 44 ( commencing with Section 921) of Title 18 of the
United States Code and the regulations issued pursuant thereto.
(6) A person who is licensed as a collector of firearms pursuant to Chapter 44 (commencing with
Section 921) of Title 18 of the United States Code and the regulations issued pursuant thereto,
15
whose licensed premises are within this state, and who has a current certificate of eligibility
issued by the Department of Justice pursuant to Section 26710.
(7) A handgun An ammunition vendor.
(8) A consultant-evaluator.
Arndt.
(9) A person who purchases or receives ammunition at a target facility holding a business or
other regulatory license, provided that the ammunition is at all times kept within the facility's
premises.
(10) A person who purchases or receives ammunition from a spouse, registered domestic partner,
or immediate family member as defined in Section 16720.
fej@ A violation of this section is a misdemeanor.

~plz note strikethroughs are not showing up in above text.

I've been asking around. I got a very corporate answer from MidwayUSA that their lawyers are looking in to it for instance.